Where to go after CCNA?

TIA568B

I know what you're thinking, another what cert thread, but any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I'm currently working in a customer service role, but have always been heavily into IT, the network is what interests me and some day I'd like to get into the infosec side of things, but I'm aware I'll most likely need a proven history in networking before I'll get that. I passed my CCNA at the end of September and I'm wondering where to go now and what I should be working towards next.

I'm planning to get a foundation level knowledge of ITIL V3 so I can at least talk the language, but I find it puts me to sleep as it's about the business, not the technology (.. Yes, I know!). I was originally planning to go for CCNA: Security, but I've recently been advised I'd be better off leaving any sort of specialisation until later on and they probably have a point as I'm guessing CCNP will include everything in CCNA: Security anyway.

I'm desperate to find a new job so I'm going for help desk stuff just now as my customer service experience may help with that, but at the end of the day I want something more technical.

As a second cert should I be continuing down the Cisco path or would I be better off getting something a bit more general under my belt (Linux+, Network+, something MS?) before I go for the CCNP?

Any advice, suggestions, mistakes not to make would really be appreciated.

David

Balantine

Server+

TIA568B

Just brought up some sample questions for Server+ in Google, don't know how similar they'll be to the actual exam, but I'm certainly going to have a look into it as it looks like it could be a quick way of adding an extra line to my CV. Most of the questions seem relatively simple (got experience selling servers etc.), I just need to brush up on SCSI stuff.

echo465

Security+ maybe? It wasn't that hard, and there are good study resources for it.

unclerico

The ccnp will not test on most things that you'll find on the ccna:security. If you don't have the professional level of experience (3-4 yrs IMHO) leave the ccnp alone. if you put ccnp on your resume without having actually worked in a data center, noc, or other customer facing role you're asking for either flat out rejection or some brutal interviews. I've interviewed people that are supposed to be sr level and so I grill them to the point that they are asking what the hell just hit them. The issue is that while they have the letters after their names they don't have the industry experience to back up the credentials. I grill the crap out of these types for two reasons 1) to humble them and 2) to show them that just reading some books and taking exams does not make them qualified to be a network engineer.

If networking is your game round yourself out with all of the CCNA certs. Learn all you can about virtualization as it is the present and the future. It might not hurt to look into Linux since you want to get into infosec.

Bl8ckr0uter

Do some studying and when you feel up to some more certs do CCNA:S and/or Security+ and then go from there. Learn linux and/or windows basics (it probably doesn't matter which on). I would also that that IF you decide to go for CCNP, make sure that you study the material completely. Go above and beyond CCNP material. Learn TCP/IP and common security tools and the hows and why they work.

Turgon

unclerico wrote: »

The ccnp will not test on most things that you'll find on the ccna:security. If you don't have the professional level of experience (3-4 yrs IMHO) leave the ccnp alone. if you put ccnp on your resume without having actually worked in a data center, noc, or other customer facing role you're asking for either flat out rejection or some brutal interviews. I've interviewed people that are supposed to be sr level and so I grill them to the point that they are asking what the hell just hit them. The issue is that while they have the letters after their names they don't have the industry experience to back up the credentials. I grill the crap out of these types for two reasons 1) to humble them and 2) to show them that just reading some books and taking exams does not make them qualified to be a network engineer.

Correct. 10 years ago when things were shiny and new a CCNP opened doors and most companies didn't know what they were doing. Today you have firewalls with 100+ interfaces, and thousands of SLA traffic flows moving around. You need to know what you are doing which takes years these days Im afraid. There is no longer any fast track to a career in networking.

TIA568B

Thanks a lot for all of the feedback, I'll hold off the CCNP for the time being then, I probably wouldn't be going for any CCNP level jobs anyway as I realise the lack of experience would let me down, but going for CCNA level jobs with a CCNP might risk me appearing "over qualified" so it might be a bad thing too, once I get my foot in the door somewhere I'll start worrying about the CCNP.


I've been thinking of going down the virtualization route as I am seeing a lot of jobs asking for VMWare etc., I think I'll really need to build a pretty beefy box and have a play with it, when it comes to simulating network devices is GN3 the best for this or is there any alternatives as it's not something I've ever really looked into?


I've been renting a Linux VPS for a few months as I already had a reasonable level of linux experience, but I wanted more.


I think I'll probably just stick with my original plan of doing CCNA:S and maybe Security+. If I can find a way to get some time off work for an exam before xmas I might do Server+ too as I have built, upgraded, sold and generally played about with a lot of the stuff I can see in notes and sample questions, there's just a few aspects of SCSI and RAID I'd need to brush up on.

Bl8ckr0uter

unclerico wrote: »

The ccnp will not test on most things that you'll find on the ccna:security. If you don't have the professional level of experience (3-4 yrs IMHO) leave the ccnp alone. if you put ccnp on your resume without having actually worked in a data center, noc, or other customer facing role you're asking for either flat out rejection or some brutal interviews. I've interviewed people that are supposed to be sr level and so I grill them to the point that they are asking what the hell just hit them. The issue is that while they have the letters after their names they don't have the industry experience to back up the credentials. I grill the crap out of these types for two reasons 1) to humble them and 2) to show them that just reading some books and taking exams does not make them qualified to be a network engineer.

If networking is your game round yourself out with all of the CCNA certs. Learn all you can about virtualization as it is the present and the future. It might not hurt to look into Linux since you want to get into infosec.

My problem with this is the chicken and egg situation. Don't get the cert until you have the experience but you need the cert to get the experience. We all know cert<>experience. I personally think that the knowledge gained by studying for and possibly obtaining a CCNP would greatly help anyone in a CCNA level job. Looking back on it, I wish I read Routing TCP Vol I+II when I did my NA or the SWITCH guide (well the old switch exam). It would have helped me greatly.

lsud00d

Did you do CCENT-->CCNA or the combined test for the straight CCNA?

dave330i

TIA568B wrote: »

I've been thinking of going down the virtualization route as I am seeing a lot of jobs asking for VMWare etc., I think I'll really need to build a pretty beefy box and have a play with it, when it comes to simulating network devices is GN3 the best for this or is there any alternatives as it's not something I've ever really looked into?

Don't know about Scotland, but here you need Windows experience and generally Linux experience along with VCP.

TIA568B

lsud00d wrote: »

Did you do CCENT-->CCNA or the combined test for the straight CCNA?

Went for the combined 640-802 exam as I'd went through the Cisco Network Academy so I didn't find it too difficult (although I thought I was going to fail until I got the message saying I'd passed!).

N2IT

Linux + would be a nice addition

unclerico

Bl8ckr0uter wrote: »

My problem with this is the chicken and egg situation. Don't get the cert until you have the experience but you need the cert to get the experience. We all know cert<>experience. I personally think that the knowledge gained by studying for and possibly obtaining a CCNP would greatly help anyone in a CCNA level job. Looking back on it, I wish I read Routing TCP Vol I+II when I did my NA or the SWITCH guide (well the old switch exam). It would have helped me greatly.

I don't see it as a chicken/egg situation. If you have your ccna then apply for jobs requiring a ccna. You work with hands on for a few years. When you're ready for the next step then get your ccnp; you will be qualified both in terms of years on the job and as a cert holder.

Bl8ckr0uter

unclerico wrote: »

I don't see it as a chicken/egg situation. If you have your ccna then apply for jobs requiring a ccna. You work with hands on for a few years. When you're ready for the next step then get your ccnp; you will be qualified both in terms of years on the job and as a cert holder.

W

What I am saying with so many CCNAs on the market you may need a CCNP to stand out from the CCNAs (if you don't have experience). A person who has gone through CCNP level studying and/or certification should be much better than a CCNA who has studies CCNA level topics. Having more knowledge usually means more value for your potential company and yourself.

mayhem87

unclerico wrote: »

I don't see it as a chicken/egg situation. If you have your ccna then apply for jobs requiring a ccna. You work with hands on for a few years. When you're ready for the next step then get your ccnp; you will be qualified both in terms of years on the job and as a cert holder.

This is kind of the view im taking. I just got my ccna but am now studying for the ccnp. I don't want a np job as i have no experience but I think the extra knowledge on the routing and switching will make me stand apart from the other ccna's that have just gotten it. from there i plan on branching out to other things such as security and vcp.

Ch@rl!3m0ng

If you want to go the Sec route then I would Look at Sec + and Linux + to start off. But as you say you want to get out of your sales enviroment and into a tech enviroment. So I would go for some M$ quals first, they will also help with the sec side later on. a good quote and way of looking at security is "Know your enemy and know yourself" (Not a direct quote i think but..) I you know how something works you can have a better knowledge of how to defend it or attack it. Depending which way you go with the Sec side of things.