IT Degree's or Certs

ixnb

Are there any degree's in the IT field rather then certs, please list them. The A+ learning process do you learn just as much or ore than in the cisco's IT Essentials: PC Hardware and Software?

hackman2007

There are a ton of different degrees in IT. It just depends what you want to do (CIS, CE, CS, MIS, GIS, etc).

As for A+ versus the Cisco IT Essentials. A+ is a beginner-level cert and is designed for people with 6 months of experience (though you don't need that).

effekted

WGU, get your BA and 10+ certs in the process. Win/Win

ixnb

Thanks for the replies, just a few questions.

In the WGU which BA did you mean?

Is there anything after the A+, certs, degree? Is this not needed. I want to further pursue fields in the IT industry, network anything, CE.

ptilsen

I started my career on an A+ and no experience. You use it to get your entry-level position, if you're lucky. It's far from the stopping point.

You need to figure out a general direction. Typically, you're going to start with a focus on either systems or networking. Generally, that means Windows certs or Cisco certs in the long run. They aren't mutually exclusive, but there aren't a lot of entry or mid-level jobs that use both extensively -- mainly IT consultants, security guys.

Neither a degree nor certifications are require to succeed in any IT discipline, but it is hard to be extremely successful without both and very hard to succeed without at least one.

Getting an online degree from WGU means you are getting both a degree and certs. There are several BS degrees to choose from, depending on what track of IT you are most interested in.

Do you have any idea what general direction you want to go in? Is networking what you're thinking?

ixnb

I do want to get into networking but I also work with some systems, I guess for a job I would do networking and systems I could still do for some more experience with repairing and stuff.

ptilsen

A+ > Network+ > CCNA > MCITP:SA > CCNP might be a logical path for you. You'll certainly want to look into a degree. WGU has a BS, Information Technology - Networks Administration degree that would help you obtain those certifications.

pham0329

ptilsen wrote: »

A+ > Network+ > CCNA > MCITP:SA > CCNP might be a logical path for you. You'll certainly want to look into a degree. WGU has a BS, Information Technology - Networks Administration degree that would help you obtain those certifications.

I pretty much agree with this, except if I was doing it, I would omit the Network+. The A+ has some values in that HR recognize it, but no one that I've spoke with really cares about the Network+

ChrisRice

From reading on here I've come to the conclusion that a British IT degree is very different to an American one. (I'm British). My friend is doing a bachelors in Computer Science, the topics that they cover over the 3 years are; "programming languages, software engineering, artificial intelligence, operating systems, databases, nature-inspired computation, concurrent computing, robotics and the theory of computation" However, they do no cert work whatsoever.

He says that I should have done the same course instead of the one I'm on now, where I'll get quite a number of certs, a work placement and then have 2 years full time experience in the workplace before he even graduates, because he feels that he'll be able to get straight into a job after leaving, and a better one than I'll have. Is he right, or did I make the better choice?

advanex1

ChrisRice wrote: »

From reading on here I've come to the conclusion that a British IT degree is very different to an American one. (I'm British). My friend is doing a bachelors in Computer Science, the topics that they cover over the 3 years are; "programming languages, software engineering, artificial intelligence, operating systems, databases, nature-inspired computation, concurrent computing, robotics and the theory of computation" However, they do no cert work whatsoever.

He says that I should have done the same course instead of the one I'm on now, where I'll get quite a number of certs, a work placement and then have 2 years full time experience in the workplace before he even graduates, because he feels that he'll be able to get straight into a job after leaving, and a better one than I'll have. Is he right, or did I make the better choice?

Chris, I would take your choice over either. You still receive a degree right? So not only do you get a piece of paper stating you have a degree, just like him, but you get certifications (which he won't) and experience (which he won't). Experience is the key there, you're killing 3 birds with 1 stone.

ChrisRice

advanex1 wrote: »

Chris, I would take your choice over either. You still receive a degree right? So not only do you get a piece of paper stating you have a degree, just like him, but you get certifications (which he won't) and experience (which he won't). Experience is the key there, you're killing 3 birds with 1 stone.

My course isn't a degree course, it's an apprenticeship. I do get some diplomas with it, but they're not really going to count for anything, I only do them because the government made it mandatory.. Even with that though, my choice seems like the best simply because I get the experience.

ptilsen

pham0329 wrote: »

I pretty much agree with this, except if I was doing it, I would omit the Network+. The A+ has some values in that HR recognize it, but no one that I've spoke with really cares about the Network+

I agree in that Network+ is under-recognized in the industry. I disagree in that I do see it a little bit on job ads, and as someone who occasionally hires low-level techs I can tell you that I put a lot of value on it. It is hard to take and pass the Network+ without having at least a decent knowledge of the OSI, how common network protocols work, and some decent network troubleshooting abilities. These are things I see lacking in entry-level techs who lack IT training.

Regardless of marketability, I also recommend entry-level techs take the Network+ because the study material will leave them with applicable knowledge of network protocols, the OSI model, and how to logically and effectively troubleshoot network problems.

dave330i

ptilsen wrote: »

Regardless of marketability, I also recommend entry-level techs take the Network+ because the study material will leave them with applicable knowledge of network protocols, the OSI model, and how to logically and effectively troubleshoot network problems.

CCENT covers same ground and you're half way to CCNA.

ChrisRice

dave330i wrote: »

CCENT covers same ground and you're half way to CCNA.

The only problem with that is that CCENT/CCNA is proprietary , whereas N+ isn't, there are things I've seen that are different to when I was doing my CCENT/CCNA course at college.

ptilsen

ChrisRice wrote: »

The only problem with that is that CCENT/CCNA is proprietary , whereas N+ isn't, there are things I've seen that are different to when I was doing my CCENT/CCNA course at college.

This.

CCENT (and CCNA) covers a lot of "How Do To Things The Cisco Way on Cisco Equipment." Network+ is vendor-neutral and provides broader knowledge of how to troubleshoot and manage networks. Yes, 75% of Network+ is covered or implied in CCENT, and 85-90% is covered in CCNA. Network+ is also a relatively easy and cheap test, so it really doesn't hurt to add it. Certainly, 90% of CCNAs with any experience could walk in and take Network+. That said, Network+ will help in studying for CCENT, and it even helps get started on the Microsoft track.

Network+, to me, is THE entry-level systems and network administration cert to have. CCENT and in turn CCNA indicate a higher skill level with switching and routing (that is, CCNA is above entry-level) and are a step towards networking administration and engineering. Network+ is almost like your license to troubleshoot networking issues and does not indicate a career path, but rather general knowledge.

pham0329

ptilsen wrote: »

Network+, to me, is THE entry-level systems and network administration cert to have. CCENT and in turn CCNA indicate a higher skill level with switching and routing (that is, CCNA is above entry-level) and are a step towards networking administration and engineering. Network+ is almost like your license to troubleshoot networking issues and does not indicate a career path, but rather general knowledge.

That's kind of why I feel the Network+ is kind of useless (in terms of marketability). Like you said, the Network+ is an entry level "administrator" cert, but no one really hires an entry level admin to run their network. The job you would want to get with a Network+ are network/system admins, but those hiring for those position doesn't take much liking to a Network+.

ptilsen

Again, I won't disagree much on the marketability side. If you're going for a networking job, Network+ won't get it for you, and it won't help you if you have CCNA. If you're going for a server/systems admin job, it doesn't hurt, but your vendor-specific cert (MS or RedHat) is what gets you that job. That said, I would argue a Net+ cert does help you get a junior admin, helpdesk, or DST role if you have minimal or no vendor certs.

I can tell you definitely that I would hire a "level 1" tech with a four-year or even two-year degree and just Network+. But the positions I'm hiring for are for troubleshooting and maintaining relatively simple SMB and SOHO networks and systems and don't require deep vendor-specific knowledge. I'm am not a Cisco guy and any Cisco or entry-level networking position will not require Network+. I still recommend it as a great piece of study material and a minor career booster, but I will not deny it does next to nothing for you if you have your CCNA. If money's tight and the Network+ is an extra ~$150 you don't need on your path to CCNA or CCNP, then forget about it.

Edit: I will also say that the market disagrees with me, but I value Net+ a lot more than A+. Yes, they are very different material, but A+ does not prove high skill with computer hardware -- just minimal skill and moderate knowledge. It is unlikely you'll find anyone with the Net+ does not have the basic hardware skills that A+ proves. Conversely, most entry-level A+-only holders cannot define a router or identify common protocols or most OSI layers. I'm not saying Net+ is more valued or sought-after than A+ in entry-level positions -- I'm just saying it should be.

ixnb

So someone with not much experience in computer repair trouble shooting, networking would be a step forward taking the A+ and network+ course's? After the A+ the next step would be Microsoft certs? Books and recommendations for related topics on the A+ and Networking. Do you think you can benefit from taking computer(trouble shooting and other stuff) classes for advanced users before and after the A+ exam?

ptilsen

The A+ is an entry-level cert for people with little to no experience. If you are good with computers but have no professional experience, it is a good starting point.

Net+ is going to be harder to get unless you are either very interested in the material or have experience. This was my path:
A+ > helpdesk job > Net+ > MCP > Desktop Support > MCSA > Server Administrator > AAS degree > Systems Engineer / IT Consultant.

I was (and still am, of course) highly skilled at fixing computers and very motivated to learn more about network, servers, scripting, computers in general.

If you have a passion for learning IT, get your A+, then start looking for a job. Study for Net+ while looking. After you get your job, finish Net+ if you haven't, and either start into the CCNA or MCITP tracks. Somewhere in that whole process, start a degree. You do not need experience or a job to get an entry-level job, but it's not easy to get one without any experience. Get good at fixing computers, then charge people to do it in your free time. That's experience. You can put that on a resume. Get tech gigs on craigslist or through recruiters. It's experience. You'll learn from it, and you can put it on a resume.

simonmoon

Cisco's IT Essentials course is preperation for the A+.

Turgon

ptilsen wrote: »

Again, I won't disagree much on the marketability side. If you're going for a networking job, Network+ won't get it for you, and it won't help you if you have CCNA. If you're going for a server/systems admin job, it doesn't hurt, but your vendor-specific cert (MS or RedHat) is what gets you that job. That said, I would argue a Net+ cert does help you get a junior admin, helpdesk, or DST role if you have minimal or no vendor certs.

I can tell you definitely that I would hire a "level 1" tech with a four-year or even two-year degree and just Network+. But the positions I'm hiring for are for troubleshooting and maintaining relatively simple SMB and SOHO networks and systems and don't require deep vendor-specific knowledge. I'm am not a Cisco guy and any Cisco or entry-level networking position will not require Network+. I still recommend it as a great piece of study material and a minor career booster, but I will not deny it does next to nothing for you if you have your CCNA. If money's tight and the Network+ is an extra ~$150 you don't need on your path to CCNA or CCNP, then forget about it.

Edit: I will also say that the market disagrees with me, but I value Net+ a lot more than A+. Yes, they are very different material, but A+ does not prove high skill with computer hardware -- just minimal skill and moderate knowledge. It is unlikely you'll find anyone with the Net+ does not have the basic hardware skills that A+ proves. Conversely, most entry-level A+-only holders cannot define a router or identify common protocols or most OSI layers. I'm not saying Net+ is more valued or sought-after than A+ in entry-level positions -- I'm just saying it should be.

The UK does not value Comptia certs at all. Just saying.

ptilsen

Turgon wrote: »

The UK does not value Comptia certs at all. Just saying.

I'll keep that in mind. Do you know if there's any particular reason why? Do UK schools teach some of the entry-level skills covered in Comptia exams? I'm honestly curious. From what little I have read of the UK and also Australian IT job markets, it's seems they're very different than the US.