msi installers are they a dying breed?

I really hate MS software installer in GPO it sucks. the options it gives you my God what gives?
It works sometimes and most of the time it doesn't and they I have to install 70 workstations with the updated MSI.
I know I am doing it right.

Do you guys know of any MSI installer program that can replace Microsoft deployment msi installer?
help
thanks

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neathneathneath

I know I am doing it right?

Don't have any trouble with MSI's myself, I find it works very well.

itdaddy

that is good for you. There is not much to really using it that is why I said I know I am doing it right.
It is not much to it...it is just hodge podge..glad it works for you but I hate it

kriscamaro68

itdaddy wrote: »

I really hate MS software installer in GPO it sucks. the options it gives you my God what gives?
It works sometimes and most of the time it doesn't and they I have to install 70 workstations with the updated MSI.
I know I am doing it right.

Do you guys know of any MSI installer program that can replace Microsoft deployment msi installer?
help
thanks

MSI's are all I pretty much use to deploy software out via SCCM to 1200+ computers. Never really have major issues. There are the few computers out there that are crap but nothing crazy. What is going on that is causing you problems?

itdaddy

i assign the msi to the previous installed. everytime i add a software i am suppose to assign and i do
it has not worked but i just read i may not have to specify the upgrade option. and this next month
i wont and see what happens? that might be my iii ssue. i will try and let you know. plus if you want to remove the list of old installs, you cant or it says "remove and do not allow further installs" you: just canot remove it. how stupid. how about "remove it and allow further installs" just to clean it up. you know what
i mean?

kriscamaro68

When I am going to update software that is already installed I usually get the uninstall string and run that first in my package then, after that finishes I run the msi to install the latest full version of the software. I dont like doing updates via MSI as I have seen issues with that.

ptilsen

I've deployed many MSIs within many organizations. I've not encountered any issues that weren't a result of incorrect configuration, underlying hardware/software/network problems, or poor installer design. Regardless, I've really not encountered widespread issues with MSI deployments using GPOs.

I don't know you or your experience, so don't take this the wrong way. I see Cisco certs and Cisco aspirations. I assume Cisco experience. MSIs are relatively easy to deploy, but you still need a strong underlying knowledge of how they work and how Windows and AD work. Again, I don't know you or your experience, but I don't see high-level MS certs in your profile or WIP. I assume limited high-level MS experience. This might be outside of your current skillset. Yet again, I apologize if I'm wrong, but I have to point it out based on what I see.

itdaddy

you said: poor installer design

yep that is what it is. you are correct.

I have a BS in computer science! It is the programmers fault. The MSI packaging software they use sucks.
MSI is easy to use almost child-like in use but like I said the options are stupid. If I want to clean up the old installs the options they give me are dumb. No matter how many certs I have. I have plenty of experience with MS stuff. The problem lies with the package installer they use.

I just wish I had a better 3rd party installer. The option I do not like is "Remove but do not allow any further software to be installed. I apologize but you must have a great package msi maker. I just was looking for a better MSI Installer that was faster as well. Microsoft MSI Installer through GPO is dog slow in fact I have made some software myself using visual c# that is much faster but the msi package installer that our vendor uses, it doesn't work with it. Just thought I could find a better installer through the tech exams. But thanks for your help.

crrussell3

What is telling you the option "Remove but do not allow any further software to be installed"? The msi uninstall or when you remove a gpsi from group policy?

I have been using gpsi and have never had an issue with it, and we deploy to 250 workstations across seven sites, with three sites having local dc and dfs software share, and another site with just a dfs software share. All gpsi reference the dfs location. Next month i will be deploying System Center Essentials 2010, so that will hopefully make my life even easier with more deployment options.

itdaddy

crrussel3 doesn't it take a long time to install software ? and push out. I wanted to clean out the previous installs to start fresh but I do not want
to PREVENT further installs. You know what I mean? I wanted to clean the install screen out and when I tried it says that. I just want to clean it out and start over. but I do not want to prevent further installs of this msi deployment. So how do you clean the install screen out. You know
you click on Software Instation and you see the screen with all the msi previous installs. I want to clean this out without Preventing further installs.
Thanks man...I really think it is the crappy MSI package installer they use but what do you think? thanks

crrussell3

Are you referring to one of the two choices you receive when you right click a gpsi and select All Tasks -> Remove? If so then it won't prevent you from installing it in the future, it just stops it from installing through gpsi. Basically any package listed there will install until you remove it. The only way to get it to deploy through gpsi again would be to recreate the package (which would then redeploy to all workstations again even if they already have it installed) or to restore the gpo back to when it still contained said package.

I have yet to really notice a time difference when installing the software through gpsi unless I am pulling it over a wan. The method used is no different then if you create a batch file to automate the install, or run it by hand and have to next next finish the installer. If you are finding that it is taking considerable more time to install then you have some underlying issues that are causing that. I would enable logging and see what is going on.

itdaddy

crrussell,

yeah that is what I mean. So if I remove the old files that are dead and gone. I an add another new package that
hasnt been installed yet and it will install. I was afraid of what it said. I just want to clean up the list and when I read what it said like no more installs, I was like yikes! And yeah it is slow..I do not understand why is slow. I have automated gpupdate /force to run on all pcs to get it to work, then I have to reboot them ot get it going. I have no clue why it takes os long...Be nice if a msi program would first push ouut the msi to each machine during the day, and later on that day run them purely on that workstation to use that worksations resources. We use to do it that way and I have no time right now to debug why it is doing that but that is what my old program I built did and took ony 5 minutes to install and 20 minutes later I was home. but as it stands now using GPO takes like 1 or 2 hours to push out and install and most of the workstations are poky in responding to a policy update to then install the msi? I just do not know how to make the workstations ask for policy updates faster?
DO you? thanks man..Does GPO need to be defragged or something once in a whie?

crrussell3

Sounds like to me you need to seriously audit all gpo's that you have. I would generate a report for all your gpo's, save to a pdf/excel/word, and go through each and every setting to make sure you know what it is doing and determine if it really is applicable to your network. Then make a backup of all your gpo's (which you should be doing anyways) and slowly start implementing the changes (ideally do it in a test environment first). Bloated or poorly configured gpo can wreak havoc on a computer startup/shutdown and user login/logoff. Coming to my job I currently have, I fixed tons of gpo issues and trimmed roughly 30 seconds off startup times on a typical workstation.

And yes, if you remove gpsi that you no longer need to have deployed, it will only prevent it from installing UNTIL you recreate the gpsi for that install package. It will never prevent you from installing it or anything else in the future.

Using gpudate /force is not needed with gpsi, considering it can't install if it is assigned to a computer unless it is restarted. During that time, the computer will poll sysvol for gpo changes and install anyways. Typically, gpo settings refresh every 60-120 minutes.

As for why your installs are "slow", there are many places to start looking:
1. Are you saturating your through-put on your switches/routers if restarting all computers at the same time (especially if a big installer)?
2. Are you bogging down your dc? File server (or location where installer is stored?
3. Do you have any dns issues?
4. Are you pulling across a wan?
5. Do you have any corrupt or poorly configured gpos?
6. Did you remember to press "up up down down left right left right a b start" before restarting the computers

itdaddy

And yes, if you remove gpsi that you no longer need to have deployed, it will only prevent it from installing UNTIL you recreate the gpsi for that install package. It will never prevent you from installing it or anything else in the future.

yes dead on thanks man. This helps. I wasn't sure and witih MS$$ I never want to guess...

I do think we have something wrong with GPOs and yeah I could go thru them all and that would be best.since yeah we have a DC at each branch
and yep it is pushed out at each branch..I will for sure look stuff over thanks man. I appreciate your depth knowledge and experience.

crrussell3

Not a problem its what everyone is here for.