pc upgrade

jamesleecoleman

Hi!!

I'm looking to upgrade my computer from an Intel Pentium D with 4 gb of ram at 800 mhz to most likely the AMD FX eight core processor with 8gb of ram at 2ghz (if I read that right). I was told that Intel has some good processors for virtualization but all the processors are pretty expensive. I will be running about three to four virtual machines at a time. I won't be doing anything big because I'm a student and I will be taking some microsoft classes that deal with 08 server and windows 7. I will also be running metasploitable, backtrack, and opensuse linux 12.1 when I study some security stuff on my own. I hope the set up will also help with running gns3 because I get very poor performance right now. I'm still trying to find a cheap hard drive to put windows 7 64bit on.

I am on a budget of $500 dollars now.

This is what I have so far:
Newegg.com - AMD FX-8120 Zambezi 3.1GHz Socket AM3+ 125W Eight-Core Desktop Processor FD8120FRGUBOX
Newegg.com - GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3 AM3+ AMD 990FX SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard
Newegg.com - Mushkin Enhanced Blackline 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 2000 (PC3 16000) Desktop Memory Model 996991

Could anyone offer me any advice and/or input?

instant000

My advice is to not do what I did.

I decided that I needed some old "el-cheapo" lab computers, so I decided to order them from E-bay, in pieces.

Well, it turns out that I will end up getting a couple cheap computers, with 3 GiHZ proc, 4/ GB ram and 40 GB HDD, for less than $150, but .... it's taking like two weeks for everything to come in. (And this is not counting the two weeks I spent scrounging around trying to find all the parts I needed in the first place.)

My wife used one of my own favorite quotes against me "How much is your time worth?" We got a good laugh out of that one.

So, as long as you can get it in a reasonable period of time, not a big deal. Just don't waste so much time looking for stuff that you're losing out on time you could have spent labbing.

As things sit right now, I'm waiting on hard drive caddies to come in (didn't think to order those).

If I had seen my wife doing this, I would have immediately told her to stop wasting her time, and just buy an all-in-one bundle. Sometimes the bigger beam is indeed in your own eye

Hope this helps!

instant000

jamesleecoleman wrote: »

Hi!!

I'm looking to upgrade my computer from an Intel Pentium D with 4 gb of ram at 800 mhz to most likely the AMD FX eight core processor with 8gb of ram at 2ghz (if I read that right). I was told that Intel has some good processors for virtualization but all the processors are pretty expensive. I will be running about three to four virtual machines at a time. I won't be doing anything big because I'm a student and I will be taking some microsoft classes that deal with 08 server and windows 7. I will also be running metasploitable, backtrack, and opensuse linux 12.1 when I study some security stuff on my own. I hope the set up will also help with running gns3 because I get very poor performance right now. I'm still trying to find a cheap hard drive to put windows 7 64bit on.

I am on a budget of $500 dollars now.

This is what I have so far:
Newegg.com - AMD FX-8120 Zambezi 3.1GHz Socket AM3+ 125W Eight-Core Desktop Processor FD8120FRGUBOX
Newegg.com - GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3 AM3+ AMD 990FX SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard
Newegg.com - Mushkin Enhanced Blackline 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 2000 (PC3 16000) Desktop Memory Model 996991

Could anyone offer me any advice and/or input?

1. Processor - the more cores, the better, this model apparently supports virtualization and 64-bit. Might want to check the VMWARE HCL to be perfectly sure, if you're trying to use that.
2. Emulating Server 2008 and Windows 7 should be do-able in VMs on op of that.
3. If it's just for study, don't worry about getting a super-high performance HDD, capacity is probably more important than performance/speed.
4. As far as GNS3, I run 7 and 8 router labs on a multi-core with 8 GB ram in Windows 7 64-bit, and it's not a deal at all. The key is a good Idle-PC, but that's something fit for another thread, as I registered on gns3.net just to disagree with how they're telling people to get idle-pc, LOL.
5. The more RAM you can get, the better of course.



Hope this helps!

jamesleecoleman

Thank you instant000, your advice does help! I never knew about the VMWARE HCL. I'll make sure to look more into it.

SteveLord

I guess that's 1 time I would actually recommend AMD.

demonfurbie

those new 8 core cpus still get out benchmarked by the amd 6 core cpus

the 8 cores are really 4 cores with multi threading

the intel i5 2500 supports all vm software and out preforms all the amd cpus
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/434?vs=288

and price on the 2500 is
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115073 15 off make sure ya put in the promo code at check out its on the lower bottom little to the left

for hard drives i would suggest multi smaller ones and a ssd for the host os, say a 60 gig ssd for the host os and 4 250 gig for the vms one vm per hd running at once.

for a host os i would suggest linux if your using free software like virtualbox for your vms

more ram the better.

get a video card, it doesnt have to be fancy gaming one but any that will take away the onboards place the onboard ones take ram and cpu usage.

jamesleecoleman

demonfurbie wrote: »

those new 8 core cpus still get out benchmarked by the amd 6 core cpus

the 8 cores are really 4 cores with multi threading

the intel i5 2500 supports all vm software and out preforms all the amd cpus
AnandTech - Bench - CPU

and price on the 2500k is
Newegg.com - Intel Core i5-2500 Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz (3.7GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 2000 BX80623I52500 15 off make sure ya put in the promo code at check out its on the lower bottom little to the left

for hard drives i would suggest multi smaller ones and a ssd for the host os, say a 60 gig ssd for the hose and 4 250 gig for the vms one vm per hd running at once.

for a host os i would suggest linux if your using free software like virtualbox for your vms

more ram the better.

get a video card, it doesnt have to be fancy gaming one but any that will take away the onboards place the onboard ones take ram and cpu usage.

Thanks for the input and the link to the benchmark demonfurbie! I saw some numbers that I really liked in there.

The way I was thinking, if it makes sense is that if I brought newer technology, I wouldn't have to upgrade as soon. I know that the newest isn't the best though. I was also thinking about buying the 60gig ssd drive for windows 7. I really like the multi smaller hard drive idea

CodeBlox

instant000 wrote: »

1. Processor - the more cores, the better, this model apparently supports virtualization and 64-bit. Might want to check the VMWARE HCL to be perfectly sure, if you're trying to use that.
2. Emulating Server 2008 and Windows 7 should be do-able in VMs on op of that.
3. If it's just for study, don't worry about getting a super-high performance HDD, capacity is probably more important than performance/speed.
4. As far as GNS3, I run 7 and 8 router labs on a multi-core with 8 GB ram in Windows 7 64-bit, and it's not a deal at all. The key is a good Idle-PC, but that's something fit for another thread, as I registered on gns3.net just to disagree with how they're telling people to get idle-pc, LOL.
5. The more RAM you can get, the better of course.



Hope this helps!

Sounds like exactly my specs. I can run 9 routers in GNS3 with no problem. CPU Usage goes to 0 percent. It's because I chose a good IDLE. I could probably run way more. I had to go through trial and error just to get the IDLE-PC value right though. Not sure how you got it.

NetworkingStudent

demonfurbie wrote: »

those new 8 core cpus still get out benchmarked by the amd 6 core cpus

the 8 cores are really 4 cores with multi threading

the intel i5 2500 supports all vm software and out preforms all the amd cpus
AnandTech - Bench - CPU

and price on the 2500 is
Newegg.com - Intel Core i5-2500 Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz (3.7GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 2000 BX80623I52500 15 off make sure ya put in the promo code at check out its on the lower bottom little to the left

for hard drives i would suggest multi smaller ones and a ssd for the host os, say a 60 gig ssd for the host os and 4 250 gig for the vms one vm per hd running at once.

for a host os i would suggest linux if your using free software like virtualbox for your vms

more ram the better.

get a video card, it doesnt have to be fancy gaming one but any that will take away the onboards place the onboard ones take ram and cpu usage.

Just wondering, why would you want a vm on each hard drive?
He has the same setup I have, except I have a coreI7 processer..8 gigs of ram gigyabit board
and 2 500 gig hard drives.

Check and see if your school has a partnership with Microsoft, that’s how I got my Windows 7 Ultimate on my computer.
MSDNAA School Search

demonfurbie

Hard drive seek times

1 spindle for 1 vm means less spinning to get the info

ptilsen

A single SSD containing all VMs will be faster and much than doing as few a three hard drives for one-VM-per-drive. Four 250GB hard drives will cost $350-$400. For around half that, you can get an SSD that will hold your host OS and all your guest VMs, and it will perform much better.

If you haven't bought hard drives in a while, you might not be aware of this. Due to the flooding in Thailand causing shortages, hard drives are extremely expensive, with low-capacity (sub-500GB) cost generally exceeding $0.30/GB, and even 2TB drives exceeding $0.08/GB. By comparison, not long ago there was almost no such thing as a 7200RPM hard drive costing more than $0.10/GB, and the 1TB and above were typically under $0.05/GB.

Now is simply not the time to buy hard drives. An SSD is going to be much more cost effective for guest and host OS operating system. You get a big HDD for any large programs and mass storage, and use your SSD for everything else. I can tell you from extensive experience that running just one VM off of a 1TB 7200RPM drive is slower than running five concurrent VMs, several programs (Steam, Dropbox, a full-screen game, even) and my operating system off of my SSD. Trying to run more than one concurrent VM off of a single spindle is painful, put an SSD can handle several concurrent VMs with ease.

I would recommend a 120GB SSD as a minimum. This will let you install Host, VirtualBox, and five to seven guests while still leaving some room for other programs. If you are going to install a whole bunch more and want it on the SSD, go with something a bit larger. I have a 250GB (~238GB binary, usable) and I have half a dozen games, a dozen VMs, some random multimedia, another dozen programs, and my OS on it. It's extremely fast, and I could never go back to a hard disk for labbing or for my host OS.

jamesleecoleman

I will use the Windows 7 pro 64bit version that I have access to through MSDNAA for the upgrade.
I'm actually thinking about getting a SSD or two (32 or 64gb). I'll just use the HDD to back up my stuff.
This is the first time that I might use a SSD on my personal computer.
I'm very excited about upgrading my computer but I'm trying to think about the future too.

ptilsen

You should really be thinking about 120GB. That is the $/GB sweet spot right now. There's not really much benefit from getting several smaller SSD. You're taking about maybe shaving a second off a VM boot time compared to sticking it all on a larger SSD. Unlike HDDs, SSDs don't take an exponential hit from multiple sources of I/O. Their throughput does not vary greatly based on number of concurrent I/O sources, so running several tasks on one is not a problem.

jamesleecoleman

I honestly cannot afford a 120GB drive right now. I'm not going to buy multiple SSDs just to try to have some type of performance boost. I'm not really comfortable with having only one drive. I just want better all around performance than I already have now because I built my computer four or five years ago. I just want my computer to handle multiple VMs better than my computer can do now and I would like to play current games without any problems.

Deciding all of this stuff is difficult for me because I want to make the right choices. I read a quote and it said that "If you think it's cool than you don't need it"