5 signs your resume is outdated.

Everyone

Got this via e-mail today...
5 Signs Your Resumé is Passé

1st 3 are things I've told people quite a few times here.

QHalo

I remember a link someone posted about not using PDF because it messes up resume search applications. I guess if you're sending it directly to someone then send it PDF but every place that I've sent one in that format to, they've asked for it in Word.

Everyone

QHalo wrote: »

I remember a link someone posted about not using PDF because it messes up resume search applications. I guess if you're sending it directly to someone then send it PDF but every place that I've sent one in that format to, they've asked for it in Word.

This is true, and I pretty much always use Word. I think the reason you get asked for it in Word format if you send a PDF in, is because the recruiter wants to add your resume to their internal database so it can be searched later, and it has to be in Word format for them to do that.

Plantwiz

Keeping it to one page is still critical. We'll toss them, as will several others I know. No one is so important they need more than 1 page to introduce their history to a new employer. All the other stuff is for the interview.

E-mailed resume's...only if that is how the company accepts them. I LOVE (sarcasm) how people 'blog' about the new and only way to do things, when they have obviously left off MOST of the hiring businesses in their piece. Perhaps in a particular industry. Or a particular size of company. However, my clients, my colleagues and even some of our competitors still value the time-and-true K-I-S-S method.

I agree on omitting an objective. I never understood that one. As well as references. That's a no brainer IMO. As far as PDF vs .doc, I've seen several places who wanted it in a .doc format, so again, follow the directions and if nothing is specified use the method 'most' people can read without much difficulty.

I'll add Listing more than the past 3 jobs is almost a reason to 'file' that resume away. If an applicant lists their last 5+ jobs, they don't have any focus. If they list their entire history, that job they held an Mickey-D or their paper route, better have something to do with the current job they are applying for because it is accepted that most people take jobs to fill inbetween other jobs. Especially early in ones career. By the time one is 40 or 50 years old, the last one or two jobs will likely have a decade or more of time and not much previous to the last 10-20 years needs to be listed. Again, save stuff for the interview!

tpatt100

I always send it in Word but make sure I save it in the Office 97-2000 format. It's a habit of mine, I also don't use the templates Microsoft provides because some of them get wonky when somebody else opens it. Lately I send it in PDF format also just in case.

quinnyfly

Great thread,

I have used "ACE the IT Resume by Paula Moreira." She also has another book that is all about the interview and the interview process, both very recently published and relevant. Great sources, check em out on Amazon:http://www.amazon.com/ACE-Resume-Resumes-Cover-Letters/dp/0071492747/ref=pd_sim_b_1

Everyone

Plantwiz wrote: »

Keeping it to one page is still critical. We'll toss them, as will several others I know. No one is so important they need more than 1 page to introduce their history to a new employer. All the other stuff is for the interview.

Wrong. If you're tossing 2 page resumes out for senior level positions, you're probably throwing out your best candidates. No more than 1 page for entry through mid level. No more than 2 pages for senior level.

I have a 2 page resume, and the last time I actively looked for a job, I had an 80% success rate with it. Meaning 8 out of every 10 companies I sent my resume to, called me to setup an interview. I've seen people with just as much experience as I have try to squish things into a single page, and have less than a 5% success rate with it.

Plantwiz wrote: »

I'll add Listing more than the past 3 jobs is almost a reason to 'file' that resume away. If an applicant lists their last 5+ jobs, they don't have any focus. If they list their entire history, that job they held an Mickey-D or their paper route, better have something to do with the current job they are applying for because it is accepted that most people take jobs to fill inbetween other jobs. Especially early in ones career. By the time one is 40 or 50 years old, the last one or two jobs will likely have a decade or more of time and not much previous to the last 10-20 years needs to be listed. Again, save stuff for the interview!

I agree with most of this. You should only list RELEVANT jobs. However it is also important to not make it look like you had big gaps between employment. So if you had an irrelevant job between 2 relevant jobs, list it, but don't go into detail about it, just show that you maintained employment.

When you get to that point where you have 20+ years of experience, yes you probably don't need to put more than the last 10 years worth on your resume. Again it comes back to relevancy, anything older than that is probably no longer relevant. There will always be some exceptions to this.


The point of the resume is to get the interview. If you try to save too much for the interview, you probably won't get it! These aren't the kind of jobs where they interview you just because you filled out an application. You can't just send someone a document that has nothing more than your name and contact info on it.

N2IT

I personally would rather show employment history over a big gap. Even if it's a one liner with dates. I was in real estate for 2 years and I list a one liner and then it's onto the next job.

Plantwiz

Everyone wrote: »

Wrong. If you're tossing 2 page resumes out for senior level positions, you're probably throwing out your best candidates. No more than 1 page for entry through mid level. No more than 2 pages for senior level.

Agree to disagree.

There is very little reason for more than one page. Very little. Being concise and clear is critical for higher level professionals. What sort of filler is being added that it cannot be stated in one page?

My comments are from my experience. My colleagues insights. And simply what is looked for around this region. We're not from a Fortune 500 Company. A very good resume can be built and be successful in one page.

I have a 2 page resume, and the last time I actively looked for a job, I had an 80% success rate with it. Meaning 8 out of every 10 companies I sent my resume to, called me to setup an interview. I've seen people with just as much experience as I have try to squish things into a single page, and have less than a 5% success rate with it.

Congratulations.

Again, I don't see any reason to **** with font or to squish any content. A good consise resume is successful for higher level positions by only using one page. This two-page mantra is a more recent 'trend' and simply doesn't make for a better candidate. The cover letter along with a clear, consise resume will land a job, a good job. The candidate needs to include only the pertinant information.


The spelling errors usually jump out easier on the longer resumes, which makes them go into the file (since we are required to maintain them for six months).

N2IT wrote:

I personally would rather show employment history over a big gap. Even if it's a one liner with dates. I was in real estate for 2 years and I list a one liner and then it's onto the next job.

Correct!
A one liner may indeed be all that is needed. Certainly, the reader doesn't need an explaination that while cutting the lawn, one also swept the driveway. Or that while running a help desk your phone skills were honed. Some tasks simply go with the job, the company or the job title. Skip the redundancy.

Essendon

Got to agree with Everyone on the one/two page debate. If I were to squish my resume into a page, I'd have to reword it somewhat like this:

Maintained Active Directory, DNS, DHCP, Group Policy
Administered 40TB backup infrastructure
Administered an 8 server Citrix farm
Supported a multi-cluster VMware environment.

Now what does this tell you about what I really did? If I elaborated a little, say added a sentence to each, my responsibilities suddenly become clearer. Suddenly the resume spills over one page into the second too.

Plantwiz

@Essendon,

How much stuff do you have written that adding even a sentence to each is going to cause you to add a whole second page? Using a standard 8.5 x 11 sheet of paper surely you have enough space for a title/name block, experiences and education. And what sort of things do you feel are necessary to explain about "Maintained AD, DNS, DHCP, GP"? In all seriousness, does one need to say they added new users? Deleted or restricted old users/terminated users? Changed passwords? Etc...?

When I want a data entry person, I'm curious about how many WPM they type and their ability to self-correct what is typed as well as being able to spell so as not to say the problem was a 'typo'.

Help desk people need to be able to be pleasant on the phone. Think on their butt (as they will be sitting mostly, except those who chose the higher desks with headsets and want to walk in their cube). Ability to understand the systems they support and escalate as necessary.

Network Admins, Network Engineers, C-make-up your -Own titles, need to be able to quickly and clearly assess the problems, rally a team if that is the solution and implement the solution, change course if necessary. Time is money. If they hold the credentials, then a peer review will shake out all they can and cannot do. Line item detail within a resume isn't necessary. And like I stated, it is not just where I'm at. My colleagues have similar policies.

I've stopped critiquing resume's on the site. This upcoming generation is doing it how they want and as their friends gain ground/rank in business, lack of efficiency in things that don't make money for the business will continue to chew up the profits...until there are no longer profits and folks realize that 80 hour weeks are not necessary. Hiring a new candidate is very serious. My comments were to alert folks that there are companies out there who still value clear and concise communication. The candidate process is a bit longer for us than most. And it is a process. None on my team have time to wade through extra pages of communication that could have been handled in one page.

If your experiences differ from mine. I'm not surprised. I am one of the old ones on this forum and therefore have a few more years of experiences to pull from. YMMV

paul78

I don't really have anything insightful to add other than I found the conversation around one or more resume pages to be interesting. I had always assumed that it was industry or career-level specific. And there still doesnt seem to be consensus. I personally have not seen a one page resume cross my desk in over 5-10 years. Most are 2-3 pages in length. And I find that having more relevant information makes it easier to make a decision. Resumes which are only one page in length, I guess may have been eliminated as too terse or lacking in substance, or maybe just didn't exist. The resumes that I review are usually those of managers/directors or of very senior non-managers.

jamesleecoleman

I really wish there was some type of set standard on how to do a resume because it would be sooo easier for me to do.

Would it be safe to keep the two pages to show that I have over three years of customer service experience? The breakdown is that for the first job that I had was two years and one month. The last job and the current job will come to 17 months of customer support. I know some companies ask for three years of customer service experience but if my resume is going to be thrown out because its two pages, how do I show that I have over three years of customer service?

paul78

jamesleecoleman wrote: »

Would it be safe to keep the two pages to show that I have over three years of customer service experience? The breakdown is that for the first job that I had was two years and one month. The last job and the current job will come to 17 months of customer support. I know some companies ask for three years of customer service experience but if my resume is going to be thrown out because its two pages, how do I show that I have over three years of customer service?

I realize that in my previous post, I just said that I never ever see a resume that was less than 2 pages. I should have also said that these are folks usually with 15 or more years of professional experience. I would encourage you to try to fit in one page.

Everyone

Plantwiz wrote: »

My comments were to alert folks that there are companies out there who still value clear and concise communication.

You're insisting that anything over 1 page isn't clear and concise. For an entry to mid level person, I would agree with this. However when you get into positions that require 10+ years in multiple technologies, it becomes impossible to demonstrate that with a single page. If you can't demonstrate it on your resume, you will NOT* get the call for the interview where you can expand on it. Simply saying "I have XX years in..." and having a line showing you had a job, is NOT* enough.

*For MOST companies. Maybe you and your friends in your little area have your own way of doing things, but this is how it works at MOST places.

Plantwiz wrote: »

None on my team have time to wade through extra pages of communication that could have been handled in one page.

So you automatically assume that everything can be handled in 1 page? The resume of someone with 10-20+ years experience applying for a job that requires that much experience, should be the same as the fresh out of school kid with no experience?

Again, depending on the position being hired, you may be cheating yourself out of some of the best candidates.

Plantwiz wrote: »

If your experiences differ from mine. I'm not surprised. I am one of the old ones on this forum and therefore have a few more years of experiences to pull from. YMMV

How many years of experience? You're making yourself sound like you're old and stuck in your ways. I realize the majority of this forum is probably in the 0-5 years experience range, but there are a few people commenting in here in the 10-15+ range.

ptilsen

Plantwiz wrote: »

Keeping it to one page is still critical. We'll toss them, as will several others I know. No one is so important they need more than 1 page to introduce their history to a new employer. All the other stuff is for the interview.

Sorry, but that's nuts. If you have 10+ years of experience, fitting your resume into one page is just nuts. More than two is never okay, but there is a time and a place for two pages. I'll keep recommending experienced professionals go to two pages with hesitation on the basis that they probably don't want to work for the type of employer who tosses out two-pagers without hesitation.

Plantwiz wrote: »

I'll add Listing more than the past 3 jobs is almost a reason to 'file' that resume away. If an applicant lists their last 5+ jobs, they don't have any focus. If they list their entire history, that job they held an Mickey-D or their paper route, better have something to do with the current job they are applying for because it is accepted that most people take jobs to fill inbetween other jobs. Especially early in ones career. By the time one is 40 or 50 years old, the last one or two jobs will likely have a decade or more of time and not much previous to the last 10-20 years needs to be listed.

Have to disagree again. Take a candidate with five past jobs, all IT-related, average three years per job. That candidate would be foolish not to list all five jobs. I agree that listing non-IT-related jobs makes no sense if you've been in IT for more than 2-3 years. But tossing out relevant job experience almost never makes sense. Even if your first job was helpdesk for three years, that's another three years. If I want ten years of experience and you have eight, you just took yourself out of the running. An employer needs to know how long you've been in the field even if they don't need the details of your job ten years ago.

Objective and references are the obvious ones. I have to disagree with the Word one. If the employer is expecting an email cover letter with an attached resume, Word is the preferred format IMO. If they can't open Word, you probably don't want to work there. If they're really bothered, at all, even a little, by having to open word instead of PDF viewer (Word being a program that tends to open faster than PDF viewer), you probably don't want to work there.

Again, I will agree on #5 to the extent that listing your retail and food service jobs is worthless (unless, of course, that is your industry of choice -- which, if you'r reading this, it probably isn't). Once you have even a little relevant industry experience, that's all that matters -- in any industry. And I do agree with the one-liner concept. If it's your helpdesk from ten years ago or your retail job three years ago, have one line, two at the most, and be done with it. Work experience should almsot always be top-heavy.

Forsaken_GA

I agree with nearly everything PlantWiz is saying, except the no more than one page rule. My own resume is 2 pages, and it's done quite well for me, and when I was interviewing, I had no problem with 2 page resumes hitting my desk or inbox.

My own personal opinion is that if any company is going to dismiss me simply because of a 2 page resume, without even looking at it, then I don't want to work for them, as their process is not consistent with my own. He with the most information wins, and if a company is willing to make snap judgements for something as important as hiring on such superficial criteria, that does not speak well of them to me.

Each company and each interviewer is different in what they want, what they're looking for, and what method of presentation will work best. Sometimes you just have to roll the dice.

Forsaken_GA

Plantwiz wrote: »

As far as PDF vs .doc, I've seen several places who wanted it in a .doc format, so again, follow the directions and if nothing is specified use the method 'most' people can read without much difficulty.

Honestly, I don't understand why this is such an issue. If there's a lack of specific direction as to what format to provide my resume in, I simply provide it in PDF and Word. If I provide both formats and the interviewer still can't open my resume, I do not want to talk to them.