Official CCIE Build Your Home Lab Thread

Broham

Greetings folks, I'm making this thread in hopes that it can be a one stop shop for reference to build the home lab successfully, any modifications discussion etc. I myself am in the process of building the lab but would like some advice.

Is it wise to just emulate the routers on gns 3 and then add the 4 physical switches via card?

If the lab is fully built, what order would be best to buy? I was thinking 1 router, 1 switch and repeat until I am able to build out.

Below are the ine specs being used: Copyright INE

R1 2610XM 128 MB 32 MB 32 KB two WIC-1T
R2 2610XM 128 MB 32 MB 32 KB two WIC-1T
R3 2611XM 128 MB 32 MB 32 KB one NM-4A/S
R4 1841 256 MB 64 MB 191 KB two WIC-1T
R5 1841 256 MB 64 MB 191 KB two WIC-1T
R6 1841 256 MB 64 MB 191 KB two WIC-1T
SW1 3560-24TS-E
SW2 3560-24TS-E
SW3 3550-24-EMI
SW4 3550-24-EMI
3 bb routers

Thanks

Useful links for different options:

How to build hybrid ccie lab with GNS3 - IEOC - INE's Online Community
CCIE Lab using GNS3 and Quad NICs for Switches - YouTube

Useful discussion links:

Dynamips to real switches with QinQ support « Bridging the gap between CCIE RS and SP
7200emu.hacki.at :: View topic - What's more efficient:1 NIC--> QinQ or multiply NICs?


* Will update with progress of lab

jamesp1983

I have INE's exact lab at home. I just didn't want to waste anytime in investigating issues that can be tracked back to GNS3. A lot of people have the hybrid GNS3 and physical switch lab and are thrilled with it. It's cheaper and your electric bill will be lower.

Forsaken_GA

I initially went with 3 3640's and 4 3550's, the rest built to INE's standards (except for BB1, which I used an old 2600 with an NM-8A/S instead of the 2500 model they recommend, the BB routers you just configure once and then leave them alone, so I only had to edit the configuration once)

I have since replaced the 3640's with 1841's, and my pair of 3560's to make my lab entirely INE compliant should be arriving this week. I find it alot less hassle to just turn on the rack and drop in the pre-configs without having to edit interface names. It may end up being cheaper to go the GNS3 route, but given the time investment of the CCIE, I prefer to work on real equipment. No one ever said this crap would be cheap, but the potential ROI is *very* good given the CCIE's upside.... as long as you can finish.

keenon

I have the dynamips /real switches setup and it works great. not a fan of gns3 front end app. My rack is built to 360 spec. Power use was a big deal for me when deciding to rebuild rack. I prefer powering up 6 devices vs 14+

Broham

Thanks guys for your responses. If there are any helpful links, I can update first post. Regarding the dynamips/real switches setup, did you just buy a quad nic card online? Any brands or anything to look out for? Also, what router are you using to emulate, the 3700 I believe works in dynamips, is this router 100 percent capable of all features with the ccie objectives etc. I know switchwise some 3560s will allow all objectives to be met.

For full lab/ how hot does it get with all that power? My concern would be is it just too much power consumption for a home.

Thanks!

Back to studying

jamesp1983

How to build hybrid ccie lab with GNS3 - IEOC - INE's Online Community
CCIE Lab using GNS3 and Quad NICs for Switches - YouTube

keenon

i choose to use usb nics as they are easily are replaceable. I'm running w2k3 server enterprise with dynamips. The box is a quad core with 6gb of ram but ran well at 4gb. I run 3725s exclusively for all the routers.

Broham

It seems that if the 3725 is sufficient for objectives, then it really isn't necessary at all to have physical setup for the routers. I'll begin getting the switches first.

Keenon,

You used 4 usb nics?

james,

thanks for links! will update first post

aldous

change the 2610xm's for 2611xm's. even though INE doesn't need the extra fa port if you do that then you can run cisco 360/narbik and ine. with 2610 xm's you can only do INE

also don't use 2500's for BB routers like they say. 2600 non xm's are dirt cheap and do the job better and don't need transceivers etc

jamesp1983

Broham wrote: »

james,

thanks for links! will update first post

no problem. let us know how it goes.

keenon

Broham wrote: »

It seems that if the 3725 is sufficient for objectives, then it really isn't necessary at all to have physical setup for the routers. I'll begin getting the switches first.

Keenon,

You used 4 usb nics?

james,

thanks for links! will update first post

4 lol, not even close the box has 2 per router = 12 and then 3 for the backbone routers

Broham

Keenon, Can you expand as to your setup regarding the nics. From my understanding you have a large number of usb adapters and a usb hub i'm guessing for more ports? How has the stability been with this setup? I have seen the usb to ethernet adapters going for a cheap price. buying 3 dlink cards at over 200 each is a bit costly

keenon

I bought 3 quad pci usb cards as my box has 4 usb ports onboard and 3 pci slots. the usb nics i bought at a local discount shop for cheap. I wanted to keep all the same hardware and drivers across the board. the cost is about the same if not cheaper depending on the quad nic vendor you purchase (having did that route before only to find out the nics didn't support dot1q).

I don't use any usb hubs in my setup. I helped a friend build one that had usb hubs but they were also using a laptop with their setup. Usb hubs need to be the external powered type as each nic draws power.

if you want specific hardware I can recommend what i'm using in my setup.

Broham

The physical version is around 3200 for what i've priced from ebay. If the quad nics version can severly slash that cost, it's justified, not to mention power as well. Please let me know what specific parts are in your setup. This will be helpful for any one else also. Thanks!

keenon

option A:
My box (the box is a custom build but you can get them anywhere these days)
quad core, 4gb ram, hard drive size doesn't matter but the box needs to have at least 3 pci slots for 3 4 port usb cards(use the same cards).

option B:
if your using a laptop make sure its a quad core with 4gb ram and at least 4 usb slots. you will need to purchase 2 7 port usb powered hubs. that will provide 14 connections

usb nics: I recommend exclusively using the rocketfish wii lan adapters, you can get these from anywhere from $3-8 each the chipset in the card is the same used in cisco's usb nic and many other vendors (one of the last nic's i added was a cisco usb nic)

OS: i know one person using vista and it works. As for me being this box not being used for anything else except this i run w2k3 enterprise edition (it is super stable for this type of setup)


switches well can't get you much help on the costs of those but as of late the resellers are selling 3560s for about 400

Broham

Option b doesn't look too stable with the vast volume of usb connections and hubs. I wouldn't be surprised if ports failed. What model 4 port usb card do you recommend? 3 cards vs 10 physical routers. If the solution is stable, option a would be best. I'll need to check if i have 3 pci ports, i somewhow doubt it

keenon

actually you would be surprised that it is stable, only thing you have to do with the connections is to tie them down like any other cabling you want to make look good. i also labeled each port, cable and nic to match so if i need to take it down and move it. it can be reassembled very quickly without any guessing.

bermovick

I've read rather than having a large number of NICs, you can trunk your one connection to an 'offnet' switch that takes your trunk and then connects out to each lab switch separately. I figured that would be a decent option, but I haven't even begun to try it. I'm not sure how big of a headache it would be.

[edit] I guess it's called a breakout switch - found some information after a quick google: Dynamips to real switches with QinQ support « Bridging the gap between CCIE RS and SP

keenon

7200emu.hacki.at :: View topic - What's more efficient:1 NIC--> QinQ or multiply NICs? this is a full thread dedicated to using breakout switches. It looks as if it works best with 3560 or 3750. there are many complaints on the 3550s not processing certain stuff like cdp

Forsaken_GA

keenon wrote: »

7200emu.hacki.at :: View topic - What's more efficient:1 NIC--> QinQ or multiply NICs? this is a full thread dedicated to using breakout switches. It looks as if it works best with 3560 or 3750. there are many complaints on the 3550s not processing certain stuff like cdp

And stuff like this is another reason why I prefer working on real equipment. Having to work on your equipment occasionally is cool and provides some learning experiences, except that fiddling with an emulation environment doesn't provide a whole lot of benefit if you want to be a network engineer (different ball game for sysadmins, though)

keenon

experience is experience no matter if your renting a rack or building it (all real gear or intermixed). also there is always more than 1 way to do anything.

Forsaken_GA

keenon wrote: »

experience is experience no matter if your renting a rack or building it (all real gear or intermixed). also there is always more than 1 way to do anything.

Oh, I'm certainly not disputing that there's more than one way to do something, but I respectfully disagree that all experience is of equal value, especially if some of those experiences end up distracting from the end goal, and are only applicable to your learning environment. Being able to be a dynamips ninja is not exactly a marketable skill.

NOC-Ninja

If you are a pro at GNS3, do that instead of buying the whole lab. It is the most cost effective way.

bermovick

I won't argue having real equipment would be better, but not all of us can afford all real gear. The pair of 3560's alone is going to make me eat ramen noodles for a month!

Broham

Noc- Ninja and Forsaken,

I understand where you're coming from since nothing beats the real deal. It just saves some cash to get the gns working. How much is your power bill with all those physical routers? Cost is not the only factor. I am still leaning towards the gns solution at the moment but it might not be the best if there is stability problems and other strange quirks. I don't want to waste too much time with configuration woes, hence this thread to be of some help!

What rack mounting solution are you using? I have seen a cheap 19" rack on ebay

sides14

Look at it in terms of the total learning experience. Both GNS3 and real equipment are great for studying. On GNS3, you get to work the emulation issues which provides a nice learning experience. Having the real equipment is the best because you also get the added benefit of troubleshooting layer 1 issues when things get bumped or knocked. It all boils down to what you want.

QHalo

Broham wrote: »

Noc- Ninja and Forsaken,

I understand where you're coming from since nothing beats the real deal. It just saves some cash to get the gns working. How much is your power bill with all those physical routers? Cost is not the only factor. I am still leaning towards the gns solution at the moment but it might not be the best if there is stability problems and other strange quirks. I don't want to waste too much time with configuration woes, hence this thread to be of some help!

What rack mounting solution are you using? I have seen a cheap 19" rack on ebay

skeletek These are the best racks for the price.

Forsaken_GA

Broham wrote: »

Noc- Ninja and Forsaken,

I understand where you're coming from since nothing beats the real deal. It just saves some cash to get the gns working. How much is your power bill with all those physical routers? Cost is not the only factor. I am still leaning towards the gns solution at the moment but it might not be the best if there is stability problems and other strange quirks. I don't want to waste too much time with configuration woes, hence this thread to be of some help!

It's actually not that much. My pair of ESXi servers are a bigger draw on the power than the CCIE rack (they're Proliant DL360's with redundant power supplies, so yeah, they use some juice). Heat generation is an issue, however, the lab room gets a tad bit uncomfortable during summer.

For a rack, I'm using a 48U two post rack that I, ah.... liberated from a former employer when we moved the data center.

What I would sincerely recommend is this - go over to INE's IEOC site, and pay attention to the workbook 2 forums, since INE released a dynamips version of the workbook. Take a look at all the strange problems folk run into when trying to work through the labs, and decide whether or not that the cost savings is worth that to you.

Forsaken_GA

sides14 wrote: »

On GNS3, you get to work the emulation issues which provides a nice learning experience.

This is where part of my contention comes from. It's not. Dealing with dynamips emulation issues is not a prime skill for a network engy. I used to use it for quick and dirty proof of concept labs, but IOU has replaced it for that role. When you've got to work on gns3/dynamips instead of studying, you're sacrificing the opportunity to learn something relevant to something that will ultimately be negligible in your career. I have never once in my life resolved an actual operational problem because I knew how to work around issues with gns3/dynamips. Real networks aren't emulated.

The only benefit to gns3/dynamips is cost and space. Anything else is just a rationalization. I personally prefer to go ahead and invest in real gear, since I feel that's important to my career development, but I'd like to stress that is *my* preference, and I do not think that people who choose the emulation route are incorrect for doing so.

sides14

I am definitely not discounting the real gear aspect because I prefer the hands on experience. While solving GNS3 issues are not a core skill necessary to be a successful network engineer, the ability to solve complex issues is truly a good learning experience (technical aspects only).

keenon

I have had my share of L1 and L2 issues with dynamips, as noted power is the key. my rack is built to 360 spec the cost saved on buying routers was easily shifted toward buying switches. i had a real rack for many years when the opp came to reduce space, heat, power and other misc issues that can arise i gave it a shot. there are pics of my lab posted like anyone who has a rack.

the one thing i do love about it is that you can build custom lab topo. I have one that is 17 routers purely for testing on 1 pc.

here is one of the many i have built