Have a very big predicament with a job offer

tom_dub

Hey all,

Little background on me. I'm 25 years old and currently in school for Computer Science. I have no IT or software work experience and I am looking to get a year or so of that in before I graduate to make job opportunities more plentiful.

Today I had a technical interview and basically a job offer for a helpdesk position doing user support for a very large military base. The job requires a secret clearance which they'll sponsor, also pays more than what I make now and is excellent experience as far as moving up in the industry.

Only problem is my school schedule is very random. Higher level CS courses are going to be from Monday-Thursday morning and afternoon hours. The hiring manager e-mailed me saying that I look like an excellent candidate, but the company aren't willing to consider anyone unless open for all shifts, but MIGHT work with me on my schedule, but no guarantees. I don't really want to give them the run around by going through the secret clearance process to ultimately find I cannot work the shifts. I'll also be out of work, because I have to give my current job a 2 week notice. I'm really at a crossroads on what to do. I spoke with some people who told me just to do what I'm doing now and put school #1, that these types of positions open all the time and in the future I'll be able to work it. Still, I really want to get experience in this field and will feel pretty bummed if I have to turn this down. What to do?

Akaricloud

Honestly I would say take it. Having someone to sponser you for your secret clearance is HUGE and they're likely to work with you on the schedule after because they don't want to sponser someone else for the clearance. If they really won't then put school #1, quit and find work with your clearance elsewhere.

You may never get an opportunity like this again.

webgeek

School can always be completed online

paulgswanson

I'd say it really depends on whether working for the government is your final goal or not, personally I'll never work for the government ever again. However if thats what you really wanted to do, then yes the Secret Clearence sponsor is fantastic. That stuffs expensive.

However since your still in school, and I assuming your current job does work with your schedule than I'd say your curent job holds priority.

Also pay wise, the Gov usually isn't where the money is at. The peaks are usually in the private sector. Just my 2cents

tom_dub

Akaricloud wrote: »

Honestly I would say take it. Having someone to sponser you for your secret clearance is HUGE and they're likely to work with you on the schedule after because they don't want to sponser someone else for the clearance. If they really won't then put school #1, quit and find work with your clearance elsewhere.

You may never get an opportunity like this again.

I'm not sure about that, this area is extremely heavy on the military and I got this offer within a week of searching, was maybe the 2nd job I applied for. Looking at job postings it doesn't seem like a rare thing for someone to get sponsored for a clearance.

Online isn't really an option, the degree I want can only be taken in classes at my current school. The university is pretty well respected in the area and state.

Just at a real crossroads with this, I guess I could go for the clearance and quit if it doesn't work out, but that just doesn't seem very ethical...

mikeybikes

Stay in school. That's my advice.

tom_dub

mikeybikes wrote: »

Stay in school. That's my advice.

Well taken, thank you. That's the direction I'm heading towards but just want to read the opinion of others....

mikeybikes

Let me expand on that.

From my experience, it is extremely difficult to go back to school and finish a degree in a physical classroom after you've left and spent sometime in the work place.

If I could redo it, I wouldn't have left school and pushed through it.

NetworkVeteran

tom_dub wrote: »

Well taken, thank you. That's the direction I'm heading towards but just want to read the opinion of others....

Stay in school. A CS degree from a respected school is worth much more than a Secret clearance, based on the few I know with clearances, and a quick Google of its market value.

Patel128

I fully understand what you mean. I am also doing a CS degree and my classes are all over the place.

seth479

For me, I would take the position. My guess is though they would talk to you about your schedule first to try and get it worked out before saying the job is yours or sponsoring a security clearance for you. From what I've read and heard from people I've talked to about clearances, they aren't cheap and can take months to get unless it's like a Public Trust.

I know you probably want to finish school and if you feel that's more important then by all means do so. I think if you want to stay in that area after graduation or even work for defense contractors or on military projects then this experience would be a great starting point.

NetworkVeteran

seth479 wrote: »

they aren't cheap

A CS degree from a respected school can be worth tens of thousands per year; Googling pegs the cost of a secret clearance at under $3,000, and its value to employers twice that.

matt333

finish your degree, i have yet to hear someone wish they hadn't finish there degree ASAP. It will open doors for you long term

mapletune

I vote to stay in school as well. good luck! I'm sure whatever you do it'll pay off in the end.

Rakurai

Stay in school and finish your degree, it will help you more than a Secret clearance. Being military and having my clearance, I know that what I have won't make up for the lack of degree.... or so I think.

YuckTheFankees

This isn't even a discussion. You are so close to finishing your degree, do not put anything in the way of that. If you need money to support yourself, then stay at your current company and continue your degree. If you do not need a job, take a chance on the new company and hopefully they will work around your schedule. If they do not, just find another job that will.

lantech

When you did the interview did you discuss your school schedule with them? If you did and they are still offering you a job then you should be ok.

Always discuss things like that in the interview. Any interview I've had the interviewer always asked if I had questions for him at the end of the interview which would be a great time to bring it up.

spicy ahi

If I were in your shoes, there would be three things I would look at. First, how far away am I from completing my degree. As mentioned before, there are online options in your degree of choice, so it's not that you couldn't complete it online. However, if you're almost done (say 1-3 semesters away from graduation for example) I'd most certainly stick it out and finish since its not a guarantee that you'll get even half of your credits to transfer into a new program, online or otherwise.

Second, I'd look at where I want to be with my career, and compare that with the position being offered. Is it offering the potential to learn and gain hands on experience in the areas I want to grow in? Is it a helpdesk position with potential to touch servers? or routers/switches? Maybe doing some IA work? And is it in line with what I want to do? If it is, I'd give it a long hard look. A degree is great, but hands on experience in the field of study I'd like to pursue trumps that because I can get an immediate return (as in, as soon as I start working) vs. the degree that may or may not get me where I want to go.

Finally, and most importantly, is the compensation worthwhile? Is the salary good enough to live off of? Do they pay for school? Do they pay for certification training and testing? If the company is one of the bigger DoD contractors, then all of the above apply and it might be something to look into.

My honest opinion is that you still have some homework to do before you can truly make a decision you're happy with. Checking to see if they pay for schooling is a big one just looking at your situation, and I would also do a cursory check for online CS programs to see if you find one that looks ok to you. If it all works out, you might be able to continue to go to school AND get valuable working experience. However you decide, I wish you good luck!

powerfool

Take the job and slow down the pace of school, if necessary. See if they have a tuition reimbursement program to cover what you take. If you can swing work and full-time school, then do so, by all means. I think that having this opportunities will open a lot of doors in your future. I would avoid going online if you have been going to a B&M school and are within a year done, unless this job makes it completely unfeasible.

ptilsen

Stay in school. It is not going to be feasible with this job. That much is clear. If they aren't saying up front that they will definitely make the schedule work, then they almost definitely won't. You can't get a highly reputable CS undergrad at a 100% online school, and even if you could I wouldn't recommend it.

That being said, keep looking for work while you're in school, just jobs that are flexible or work around school hours.

MiikeB

Stay in school. A secret clearance is hardly once in a lifetime, most employers will sponsor you for one if it is required for the job, especially if they are seeking people with a CS degree.

Also, unwilling to work with someone on their schedule when they are trying to complete a degree seems like a bad sign of things to come. You will probably be working different shifts all the time, weekend nights followed by weekday mornings etc.

zrockstar

I was going through a similar situation and I decided to stay in school. But if I was where you are at I would go for the job because where ever there is military, there is flexible schooling. When I was working for the DoD I was able to take classes on base which meant I could work and go to school full time. Now that there aren't any options like that here for me, I am doing just school. For you though, you should consider your options a little more roundly. Where are you located?

tom_dub

zrockstar wrote: »

I was going through a similar situation and I decided to stay in school. But if I was where you are at I would go for the job because where ever there is military, there is flexible schooling. When I was working for the DoD I was able to take classes on base which meant I could work and go to school full time. Now that there aren't any options like that here for me, I am doing just school. For you though, you should consider your options a little more roundly. Where are you located?

I live in Norfolk, VA

zrockstar

tom_dub wrote: »

I live in Norfolk, VA

Alright, I was going to recommend some schooling if you were in Southern Cal., but like I mentioned before you will be able to take classes on base. I would check out these options before you went one way or the other.

gunbunnysoulja

paulgswanson wrote: »

I'd say it really depends on whether working for the government is your final goal or not, personally I'll never work for the government ever again. However if thats what you really wanted to do, then yes the Secret Clearence sponsor is fantastic. That stuffs expensive.

However since your still in school, and I assuming your current job does work with your schedule than I'd say your curent job holds priority.

Also pay wise, the Gov usually isn't where the money is at. The peaks are usually in the private sector. Just my 2cents

Just curious, what was your role in working for the govt? Also, pay can range for the govt. vs. private role. In IT, the 7/9/11 GS scale is very common which is decent money for entering into IT. Also, if you are a vet, it's super easy to get a Veterans Recruitment Appoinment (VRA) up to GS11. After a year in IT, I was offered over $75k in the govt section with just a couple CompTIA certs and an A.S. degree. So, it depends. I'm a huge fan of the DoD side of things. And the secret clearance opens up TONS of contracting opportunities with big companies.

My Secret clearance from the Army is what opened the door to my 1st IT opportunity.

MiikeB

tom_dub wrote: »

I live in Norfolk, VA

Is this job working at the NMCI helpdesk? If so that is where I got started and I would say save yourself the headache. You will get yelled at by customers who hate the network policies and get no support from management and they are not very accommodating to personal lives at all.

I spent my early IT years at the NMCI helpdesk on NOB and while I will say I learned a lot and the experience looks great on my resume (it is the largest secure network in the world) I also saw it literally suck the soul out of many of my friends who would develop drinking problems from the stress and it would poison there outside relationships. We were once on mandatory overtime 60 hours a week for 2 months with calls in the queue every minute of it, limited to 2 minutes after call work, no support because your tech leads had to take calls too and you got 2 15 minute breaks and 30min lunch but you had to take them when they dictated.

tom_dub

MiikeB wrote: »

Is this job working at the NMCI helpdesk? If so that is where I got started and I would say save yourself the headache. You will get yelled at by customers who hate the network policies and get no support from management and they are not very accommodating to personal lives at all.

I spent my early IT years at the NMCI helpdesk on NOB and while I will say I learned a lot and the experience looks great on my resume (it is the largest secure network in the world) I also saw it literally suck the soul out of many of my friends who would develop drinking problems from the stress and it would poison there outside relationships. We were once on mandatory overtime 60 hours a week for 2 months with calls in the queue every minute of it, limited to 2 minutes after call work, no support because your tech leads had to take calls too and you got 2 15 minute breaks and 30min lunch but you had to take them when they dictated.

Yup, that's it. I appreciate the information a lot, doesn't sound conducive to my goals of schooling at all. Thanks.

WiseWun

I don't know all about the clearance and it's value but I would advise you to do both if you can. Take the risk which is little, chances are your potential employer can work with your schedule. What is your current financial situation? Are you paying for school out of pocket? Is school dependent on your current job? Do you have kids/wife that's relying on you? These elements will better help you with your decision.

Personally I would take the job offer. The reason why your in school is to find employment in the first place.You can always go back to school and continue where you left off. Having real world experience can even help you with your studies. My only concen is giving notice to your current employer and nothing works out causing you financial troubles. Do this, get a piece of paper and write down the pros/cons and see the end result.

powerfool

Well, that about sums it up. Crappy working conditions with little flexibility. Unless you just really wanted to get a clearance, I am going to change my mind and say stay in school. If it were a better opportunity, I would say go for it. While getting a clearance isn't a once in a lifetime thing, having in hand opens up more doors as there are plenty of openings where they won't sponsor folks or they need a quick turnaround. My employer went through a phase where they would not sponsor new folks because of one bad hire... it lasted for about six months before they decided to do it again.

gunbunnysoulja

3fJ wrote: »

A secret clearance is easy to get if you have a good record. And limited debt. Not everyone is squeaky clean with zero debt. But be honest and forthcoming about everything and you will be fine. They WILL find out and if you lie you are done.

You can actually have a rough record (misdemeanors) along with terrible past debt and still get a clearance, pending debt isn't huge or current. But honesty is key. You really need to disclose EVERYTHING. This shows you aren't hiding anything. If you are caught in a lie you will jeopardize getting one.

jdancer

My suggestion is to finish school. It's really hard to get motivated for studying once you are working full-time.

I guarantee you can get a clearance anytime in the future from a willing sponsor.