USAJobs.gov Application

bryguy

Applied for a federal job recently, and a former co-worker told me that unless your resume has the "right" number of keywords in it, that a human doesn't even look at it. He and others have claimed that there is an algorithm that scans the resume, and if the "right" frequency of keywords are in it, it gets considered by a human evaluator. Anyone know if there is any truth to this? Seems like a bunch of BS to me.

Gorby

In my experience of applying for jobs (I'm a federal contractor trying to get in) HR told me that it does need to include keywords from the job description in order to get pass the automated scan. HR is usually looking for your resume to show all the requirements of the job description and it's usually rated on a scoring system. It seems like each agency might have a slightly different standard for scoring and etc. For some IT positions if it's listed under 2200 I believe it's a direct hire authority position and would be easier to get a response when applying.

I would check out the following forum for more information.

https://federalsoup.federaldaily.com/

Hatch1921

I recently applied for a few jobs on the site. Each one was a little different with the requirements and what they had you fill out. One of the jobs I made it past the initial screening and was forwarded on to the next step. I didn't add anything from the job description to the resume. The process had you fill out a number of questions and based on the answers, you were either eligible for the position or not. I haven't heard back for an interview just yet... maybe this is the area where the resume should have key words? Not sure... I'm new to the process. Thank you Gorby for the link.


Best of luck to you Bryguy, keep us posted on how things turn out.

Frank

jvrlopez

I've heard the same rumor regarding the same website before.

My coworkers were discussing this once and one mentioned that he had heard of individuals taking the job posting, copying and pasting it to the end of their resume on a second page, and turning the font white to hide it as a "blank" page. They said this was done so it would come up as an exact match and get a call back.

It all sounds like hearsay and paranoia if you ask me.

devils_haircut

As a veteran, I have had zero luck on usajobs.gov. I stopped using it after a couple years with no hits. I think federal jobs are more about quotas and who you know than skills and interview performance.

santaowns

I am 2/2 for interviews when I put down I am hispanic, 0/3 when I put I was white. Take that how you want but that's my experience. I am half and half.

Gorby

unfortunatly devil's haircut, it's been my experience working my agency that many were brought on by a friend, relative or some person they knew. I remember I had to train a guy who got a GS 10 help desk role because his aunt was friends with the manager, it was a nightmare for me since I had to train the guy as a contractor..he brought a notepad around writing down how to access basic folder locations like favorites and my computer. Needless to say I ended up doing the difficult tickets while he installed firefox for customers.

The first step is just getting passed the screening (depending on keywords, quota ect). If you pass you are deemed eligible for the position and passed on to a human resources worker. Usually a certificate list is made by HR to decide who get's to interview with the manager. Some rating system is used to determined who goes through to interview with the manager first, depending on how the qualification match the job description and the answers to the survey questions by "Best", "Good" or "Eligible".

If it's a direct hire authority (mostly IT security positions with job code 2200), then some part of the points system is waived and managers can pick through resumes directly).

Good luck guys

the_Grinch

I've had the opposite experience with government jobs, no hooks and still gotten interviews/hired. That being said, only two were IT jobs. With ICE everyone got to take the test and then based off of your score and the location preference you got the call to move through the process. Compared to New Jersey, the Federal government is far more fair. At my current agency they were stunned I didn't know someone and it was only the third time in the agency's history that they hired from the outside without a hook. Is what it is if you want to work for the government you keep on trucking till you get the call. With the economy tons of people are aiming for the same job and most have a lot of experience.

Xyro

I have always thought of federal jobs as easier to get because (at least initially) it is not a human looking at your resume so as long as you tailor your resume to match the position's requirements you will be considered.

NicWhite

If you want a federal job you need to send a very detailed resume that is written to the specific job you are applying for. The more details the better even if the resume is very long. If you have major work related accomplishments add them. Volunteer work or internships add it. List all your degrees and certifications. Also if you are offered a job, your salary is set by what you document in your resume. Also read the job announcement carefully. If you do not provide all the forms required your application will NOT be considered even if you are qualified. You must turn in everything they ask for.

I work for for the federal government and have worked closely with HR.

bryguy

I'm a contractor for the agency that I applied for... It would likely be a cut in pay, but the job security would be nice. Haven't met too many new hires that weren't related to a GS13 that was already there, but I figured I'd give it a shot anyways. Thanks for the info, I'll let you know how it turns out.

Hatch1921

NicWhite wrote: »

If you want a federal job you need to send a very detailed resume that is written to the specific job you are applying for. The more details the better even if the resume is very long. If you have major work related accomplishments add them. Volunteer work or internships add it. List all your degrees and certifications. Also if you are offered a job, your salary is set by what you document in your resume. Also read the job announcement carefully. If you do not provide all the forms required your application will NOT be considered even if you are qualified. You must turn in everything they ask for.

I work for for the federal government and have worked closely with HR.

Thanks for the info...good points!




best of luck Nic with the job.

Frank

bryguy

No go.

"Based on your resume, you do not meet the required specialized experience for this position."

Guess I'll have to settle working as a contractor for more pay and less responsibility... *sigh*

jabney

Wish you better luck next time the lower GS positions seem a little easier to get.

Magmadragoon

I got the same letter that you did last week from when I applied for a entry level IT government job back in October.

bryguy wrote: »

No go.

"Based on your resume, you do not meet the required specialized experience for this position."

Guess I'll have to settle working as a contractor for more pay and less responsibility... *sigh*

NotHackingYou

What is the allure with government positions?

devils_haircut

bryguy wrote: »

"Based on your resume, you do not meet the required specialized experience for this position."

I got the same response when I applied for a part-time job with the TSA as a security agent back in 2009 when I first left the military. Somehow my service as an Infantryman (and deployment to A-stan) weren't enough, and I was told the same thing...not qualified. Sometimes I don't think they actually read a majority of the resumes.

bryguy

CarlSaiyed wrote: »

What is the allure with government positions?

For me, I think the appeal was feeling more like I was part of the team. Where I work, there's a lot of open hostility towards contractors... It was kind of a "culture shock" when I was first hired. Ah well, I'll keep trying and see what happens. Thanks for the consolations.

joeypants05

I would say if you are interested in getting a federal job see if you can't find a class that goes over navigating sites like USAjobs and the process in general. I know they have these types of classes on military bases for active duty/veterans/spouses but don't know if they exist elsewhere. I've known one person to go through a class and she was able to get a federal job afterwards.

Banks901

Good luck next time! I definitely can relate to the struggles of getting a government job through usajobs.gov . I have applied to 25+ jobs and still have not gotten to the interview phase. I've done a lot of research and talked to a lot of different people and my conclusion is this: It would be good if you knew someone in HR or someone that could pull your application, it helps when the position is direct hire, and in order to make it through the scanning process you need to have every KSA (Knowledge, Skills, Ability) qualification listed throughout your resume. Your co-worker were not bs'ing. I read a statistics that only 25% of the candidates that apply actually get through initial scan. If you have one misspelling or error you will be eliminated.

Hatch1921

Banks901 wrote: »

Good luck next time! I definitely can relate to the struggles of getting a government job through usajobs.gov . I have applied to 25+ jobs and still have not gotten to the interview phase. I've done a lot of research and talked to a lot of different people and my conclusion is this: It would be good if you knew someone in HR or someone that could pull your application, it helps when the position is direct hire, and in order to make it through the scanning process you need to have every KSA (Knowledge, Skills, Ability) qualification listed throughout your resume. Your co-worker were not bs'ing. I read a statistics that only 25% of the candidates that apply actually get through initial scan. If you have one misspelling or error you will be eliminated.

Thank you for the information.

Quick question... I would assume you were "referred" in the process... how long did it take after the referral process for you hear back from them? I was referred back in December. I know the wheels with the Gov turn slow... but... I'm thinking (safe bet?) I'm not going to hear back from anyone.

Thanks again.
Frank

curtisc83

I've been applying to GS 9/11 jobs since the beginning of the year. So far I've had about 10 interviews and zero offers. Some I'm still waiting on but the odds are against me. I'm sure its a numbers game. If I keep applying one of them will have to turn out. Till then its good practice.

I'm sure every job you applied to you can do and then some. Its your competition that's killing you plus the human HR filters. I know my opinion isn't popular here but I know GS folks look down on online schools. I work with SPAWAR and USFOR-A GS employees and some just worked their way up from humble beginnings a million years ago. Most of them attended ranked (regional and national) non-profit B&M schools.

I've never met a GS with a degree from a completely online school. I am 100% sure they exist and I always hear stories about a guy who knows someone. Usually that person was hired at a low level GS grade with no edu and worked their way up while attending an online school. I'm sure better examples exist I just don't know about them. Just realize who your target audience is. Its a 3 person panel from that agency that interviews you. Not some machine or software program. Aside from the written requirements each have their own unwritten ones.

Aside from the snobby hiring officials many of the people that get interviews and hired are at least 5 point vets with campaign medals like myself. That gives a huge edge to them. Just keep plugging away at it and something will start happening.

Banks901

Hatch1921,

Typically, once the job posting is closed you should expect to hear feedback from HR within 3 to 4 weeks, but it really depends on the agency you applied with. I received a rejection e-mail today from a job I applied for during the first week of January, but I also received an e-mail today from another agency I applied with last week. If you have been referred that is a good thing because that means you got through the scanning process. However, from what I have been told if you haven't been contacted within a month then start expecting a rejection. But again, this is all speculation... I wouldn't wait for a response, but most agencies do respond =\

Hatch1921

Banks901 wrote: »

Hatch1921,

Typically, once the job posting is closed you should expect to hear feedback from HR within 3 to 4 weeks, but it really depends on the agency you applied with. I received a rejection e-mail today from a job I applied for during the first week of January, but I also received an e-mail today from another agency I applied with last week. If you have been referred that is a good thing because that means you got through the scanning process. However, from what I have been told if you haven't been contacted within a month then start expecting a rejection. But again, this is all speculation... I wouldn't wait for a response, but most agencies do respond =\

Thanks for the information. It was a position at multiple locations... so.. I figured I should have heard something back at this point. I'll just keep applying and see what happens.

Thanks again I appreciate the info.
Frank

Verities

Gorby wrote: »

unfortunatly devil's haircut, it's been my experience working my agency that many were brought on by a friend, relative or some person they knew. I remember I had to train a guy who got a GS 10 help desk role because his aunt was friends with the manager, it was a nightmare for me since I had to train the guy as a contractor..he brought a notepad around writing down how to access basic folder locations like favorites and my computer. Needless to say I ended up doing the difficult tickets while he installed firefox for customers.

I'm a sub contractor, working on a NAVY base and more than half of the GSs' in the building I work in are all Filipino and are related in some way. Nepotism is rampant in Government jobs. I have a friend who works for the DHS, who told me job opportunities with his department are almost always forwarded to the current employees who then forward to their friends/family members before they open so they can be ready to submit there resume and be considered/selected for the positions before the general public has a fighting chance.

Personally, working for the government is not all its cracked up to be; there's a lot of red tape, which often means you have to work with your hands tied behind your back, you get paid less than the private sector, and most of the time the only way to move up is if the person above you leaves or croaks. All of which probably explain why there are so many unmotivated and lazy government employees.

zxbane

I agree with a lot of what Verities said. I am a DOD contractor and I see tons of Gov workers who got in because they either know or are related to someone. Many of them can hardly perform the role they are in and even when they do have the knowledge they just don't put in the effort because ultimately they don't really feel like they have to. I'll stick with the contractor route myself for now. Granted there isn't as much security but the pay is much better and if you have the right education/certifications/skills/clearance then you can always find another role if the one you are filling did manage to go away.

onatechmission

Hi everyone !!


I can honestly say that most of what was mentioned in this thread is pretty spot on. I am currently a DoD employee; to say the least, the hiring process is a mess. I was previously a contractor, no prior military service. To make a long story short…I was hired by the direct hire authority…I'm pretty sure if I wasn't in the door as a contractor already, I wouldn't have my foot in the door now. For anyone who are contractors try to establish a working relationship with the hiring manager, or even having a conversation every once and a while. You will be surprised with what you can find out.


As far as for upward mobility….there really isn't any unless someone croaks or retire. Even then, you aren't guaranteed anything (it all depends on the leadership). In my shop, leadership pretty much pulled Priority Placement folks who don't know anything regarding the job, but was lucky enough to have certain keywords in their resume.


Co-workers are mostly retired, disabled, both…or happened to know someone. Many just complain and drink coffee all day and talk about their pensions and the cars they want to buy next…one guy just bought a 2014 Corvette Stingray….pretty much stated that he only comes to work to use his check to pay for his car LOL


In a nut shell, it's not glorious as it may seem like Verities said….However, it can be rewarding if you love what you do, stay focused and look for an exit.

bryguy

Well, I think from all the feedback I've received, I've been thoroughly talked out of seeking government employment.

shawn2330

good info thanks

Gess

curtisc83 wrote: »

I've been applying to GS 9/11 jobs since the beginning of the year. So far I've had about 10 interviews and zero offers. Some I'm still waiting on but the odds are against me. I'm sure its a numbers game. If I keep applying one of them will have to turn out. Till then its good practice.

...I know my opinion isn't popular here but I know GS folks look down on online schools. I work with SPAWAR and USFOR-A GS employees and some just worked their way up from humble beginnings a million years ago. Most of them attended ranked (regional and national) non-profit B&M schools.

I've never met a GS with a degree from a completely online school. I am 100% sure they exist and I always hear stories about a guy who knows someone. Usually that person was hired at a low level GS grade with no edu and worked their way up while attending an online school. I'm sure better examples exist I just don't know about them. Just realize who your target audience is. Its a 3 person panel from that agency that interviews you. Not some machine or software program. Aside from the written requirements each have their own unwritten ones.

Aside from the snobby hiring officials many of the people that get interviews and hired are at least 5 point vets with campaign medals like myself. That gives a huge edge to them. Just keep plugging away at it and something will start happening.

Sorry for dredging up an old post but I wanted to add to this specifically. I've been looking at GS9/11 jobs for the last six months or so. About 40 applications, 3 interviews, and 1 offer. The offer was for a position with three vacancies in the middle of nowhere in the midwest, so I thought I might have a chance. The interview was my first in about 10 years and went poorly, in my opinion. My status was changed to "Not Referred" on USAJobs the next day and that was it. A month later I get an offer out of the blue. I called to talk about it and got them to admit the first batch of folks either declined or accepted and stiffed them, and they were working down the list instead of reposting the job. Not ideal for self-esteem, but I was upfront about my lack of InfoSec knowledge from the beginning and now I'll be going into the position with low expectations of performance which will be a nice environment to learn in. It really is a numbers game and being willing to accept something less than ideal to get in the door.

My interviews were 2 person, 3 person, and 1 person interviews. All for 2210 job openings.

I have an undergraduate degree from UMUC in a non-tech discipline. I am 2/3rds finished with my IT masters program at UMUC. In about a month I guess I'll be the first person you've 'met' that got a GS position with a purely online degree in an IT job billet.

My hiring officials/interviewers have been really pleasant. Almost too much so because I thought I nailed my second interview and that job went nowhere, it was pretty soul crushing to be honest as that job had great potential.

In full disclosure, I'm a 30%+ disabled vet with multiple campaign medals so I'm in the second highest tier for consideration and that has probably been the difference, at least in getting Referred. My problem is the jobs I apply for keep getting filled by Federal transfers. USAJobs actually accidentally sent me the name and agency of the person that got a job over me as well as the hiring authority they were brought in under, so I know for a fact it's happening. I grin and bear it knowing that in 5 years I'll be ready to transfer and then I'll be top priority. The soul crushing interview I mentioned was particularly bad because interviewed on a Friday afternoon and called back on Monday morning to get a feel for what was going to happen and she told me that it was already filled that morning, it had to have been an existing employee and I was only interviewed to fill a quota. Ouch.

I also work for a large defense contractor in a mixed GS/Contractor environment. Tired of sweating out the contract annually, really craving that job security. Oh, as an aside when I got out of the military I immediatly secured a VRA GS-5 (police dispatcher) federal job but only stayed in it for 6 months before going back to IT in the contracting world. I thought that might hurt me, turning my back on the opportunity to stay with the Feds, but as far as I can tell it hasn't.

A lot of good information in this thread but I wanted to inject my experience as a counter point.

curtisc83

Gess wrote: »

Sorry for dredging up an old post but I wanted to add to this specifically. I've been looking at GS9/11 jobs for the last six months or so. About 40 applications, 3 interviews, and 1 offer. The offer was for a position with three vacancies in the middle of nowhere in the midwest, so I thought I might have a chance. The interview was my first in about 10 years and went poorly, in my opinion. My status was changed to "Not Referred" on USAJobs the next day and that was it. A month later I get an offer out of the blue. I called to talk about it and got them to admit the first batch of folks either declined or accepted and stiffed them, and they were working down the list instead of reposting the job. Not ideal for self-esteem, but I was upfront about my lack of InfoSec knowledge from the beginning and now I'll be going into the position with low expectations of performance which will be a nice environment to learn in. It really is a numbers game and being willing to accept something less than ideal to get in the door.

My interviews were 2 person, 3 person, and 1 person interviews. All for 2210 job openings.

I have an undergraduate degree from UMUC in a non-tech discipline. I am 2/3rds finished with my IT masters program at UMUC. In about a month I guess I'll be the first person you've 'met' that got a GS position with a purely online degree in an IT job billet.

My hiring officials/interviewers have been really pleasant. Almost too much so because I thought I nailed my second interview and that job went nowhere, it was pretty soul crushing to be honest as that job had great potential.

In full disclosure, I'm a 30%+ disabled vet with multiple campaign medals so I'm in the second highest tier for consideration and that has probably been the difference, at least in getting Referred. My problem is the jobs I apply for keep getting filled by Federal transfers. USAJobs actually accidentally sent me the name and agency of the person that got a job over me as well as the hiring authority they were brought in under, so I know for a fact it's happening. I grin and bear it knowing that in 5 years I'll be ready to transfer and then I'll be top priority. The soul crushing interview I mentioned was particularly bad because interviewed on a Friday afternoon and called back on Monday morning to get a feel for what was going to happen and she told me that it was already filled that morning, it had to have been an existing employee and I was only interviewed to fill a quota. Ouch.

I also work for a large defense contractor in a mixed GS/Contractor environment. Tired of sweating out the contract annually, really craving that job security. Oh, as an aside when I got out of the military I immediatly secured a VRA GS-5 (police dispatcher) federal job but only stayed in it for 6 months before going back to IT in the contracting world. I thought that might hurt me, turning my back on the opportunity to stay with the Feds, but as far as I can tell it hasn't.

A lot of good information in this thread but I wanted to inject my experience as a counter point.

Thats great news!! Since I wrote that post all my applying finally paid off. I was offered a 2210 GS11 position in Texas. I accepted it and am now working on getting my TS started. In a few hours I am actually heading over to the MP station on base to get my fingerprints done. It's still not a final offer but everything is starting to click into place. UMUC is an online school but it's still part of the UM university system so I can't count it like I would Devry, ITT and Phoenix.