Need Advice: For Profit or Private Not for profit university?

fusestone

Thanks for the advice Hammer80...but I've heard of southwestern in fact if I were a physics major that's were I'd want to go. funny thing is lots of Liberal arts colleges have amazing science programs.

curtisc83

Hammer80 wrote: »

If your cost is $0 then there are a dozen schools with amazing reputations that will open doors that you could go to, the only thing that will prevent you from attending some of them is possibly your grades but the fact that you are or are former military it will help a lot. Here is a university that you should not go to for example Southwestern University it's a liberal arts college that nobody has ever heard of and they been around since 1840, do you know what their cost is $35,000 per semester, do not go to a school like that find one with name recognition and spend your GI Bill wisely.

I live in Gtown and that's crazy SWU costs that much. UT is right down I-35 and would be a fraction of the cost.

Hammer80

It's amazing that people would go to Southwestern and pay $35k per semester instead of going to University of Texas. The school may have an amazing science dept especially for physics but UT is pretty much the biggest research university in the world for christ sakes they have their own working nuclear reactor not to use but as teaching tool, how many universities can say that.

anoeljr

Yea you should spend the GI Bill wisely and go to a well known school. I've never heard of Arcadia University and I live in Texas and have never even heard of Southwestern. If the cost will be 0, go to the best school you can afford.

Raisin

The advantage of WGU is that you're going to graduate in at least half the amount of time as any B&M school. That means that you'll join the workforce two years early. In the IT field experience will always trump education. The only reasons to go B&M are:

A) You're not mature enough to enter the workforce and need those four years to get all the partying out of your system.

You have a shot at a prestigious ivy league school like MIT or Stanford.

C) The school can guarantee a technical internship while you're enrolled.

Most of us won't get accepted to an ivy league school and most schools can't offer a meaningful internship, so that really just leaves the four years of partying. If you're mature and ready to work go to WGU.

anoeljr

Also, do you plan to stop at your bachelors or keep going for a masters? If you want to keep going, get your bachelors cheap and then go for the gold on your masters.

Hammer80

anoeljr wrote: »

Also, do you plan to stop at your bachelors or keep going for a masters? If you want to keep going, get your bachelors cheap and then go for the gold on your masters.

Anoneljr is right, get your Bachelors cheap, these days some of the top Ivy League schools have graduate programs online, instead of spending the tons of money on the Bachelors spend the money on your Masters from a top school and work at the same time. This will net you both an awesome education and experience which is golden in IT.

aspiringsoul

Don't walk....run away from for Profit colleges. I have an AAS from a For-Profit, a BS from a Private, and I'm about to start a MS at WGU.

For-Profit Colleges

• Between 2008 and 2009, over a million students started attending schools owned by the companies examined by the Committee. By mid-2010, fully half (54 percent) of those students had left school without a degree or certificate. For Associates-degree students, 63 percent left without a degree.
• Most for-profit colleges charge much higher tuition than comparable programs at community colleges and flagship State public universities. The investigation found Associate degree and certificate programs averaged four times the cost of degree programs at comparable community colleges. Bachelor's degree programs averaged 20 percent more than the cost of analogous programs at flagship public universities despite the credits being largely non-transferrable.
• Because 96 percent of students starting a for-profit college take federal student loans to attend a for-profit college (compared to 13 percent at community colleges), nearly all students who leave have student loan debt, even when they don't have a degree or diploma or increased earning power.
• Students who attended a for-profit college accounted for 47 percent of all Federal student loan defaults in 2008 and 2009. More than 1 in 5 students enrolling in a for-profit college-22 percent-default within 3 years of entering repayment on their student loans.
• Despite dismal outcomes and high defaults, for-profit colleges enroll between 10 and 13 percent of students but receive 25 percent of all federal financial aid dollars. In 2009-10, this amounted to 25 percent of the total Department of Education student aid program funds.
• The final report estimates that the 15 publicly traded companies operating "for-profit" colleges received 86 percent of their revenues from federal taxpayer dollars.
• For-profit colleges spend these taxpayer dollars primarily on non-education related expenses: In fiscal year 2009, the companies examined by the committee spent:
  • $4.2 billion or 22.7 percent of all revenue on marketing, advertising, recruiting, and admissions staffing.
  • $3.6 billion or 19.4 percent of all revenue on pre-tax profit.
  • $3.2 billion or 17.2 percent of all revenue on instruction.
  • In 2009 the CEOs of the publicly traded, for-profit education companies took home, on average, $7.3 million. In contrast, the five highest paid leaders of large public universities averaged compensation of $1 million, while the five highest paid leaders at non-profit colleges and universities averaged $3 million.
• The investigation also documented that many companies recruiting tactics misled prospective students with regard to the cost of the program, the graduation rates of other students, the job placement of other students, and the transferability of the credit.

dj_kenshin

I just recently finished my degree at Colorado State University - Global Campus.
It's an online college that is Regionally Accredited and has a full IT degree for Bachelors of Science.
The tuition isn't bad for military, and if you were military, do you still have your G.I. Bill left?

CCNTrainee

Raisin wrote: »

The advantage of WGU is that you're going to graduate in at least half the amount of time as any B&M school. That means that you'll join the workforce two years early. In the IT field experience will always trump education. The only reasons to go B&M are:

A) You're not mature enough to enter the workforce and need those four years to get all the partying out of your system.

You have a shot at a prestigious ivy league school like MIT or Stanford.

C) The school can guarantee a technical internship while you're enrolled.

Most of us won't get accepted to an ivy league school and most schools can't offer a meaningful internship, so that really just leaves the four years of partying. If you're mature and ready to work go to WGU.

No offense but not all of us learn effectively doing strictly online schooling. If there is one thing I have noticed the last five years of improving myself, it is that I learn and focus a lot better when I am among peers especially when it comes to boring Gen Art classes. The fact that I can argue and debate with others in person on a particular subject builds a better understanding, after all nobody is built, raised, or created the same.

Thou to be fair, I would prefer to earn a degree in just completing the classes related to your discipline since I am not a fan of the "Well Rounded" philosophy. But we don't live in that type of system, so it is what it is. Another thing I would like to add, is that I plan on getting a Graduate degree in MIS from Carnegie Mellon when I am ready for that next path in my life, so B+M would increase that chance.

CCNTrainee

fusestone wrote: »

It does not matter if your opinion is its not worth it at 100k I may feel the same way however if I attend Arcadia University it will cost me $0. WGU will cost me $0. Which would be better in the long term? A private university I physically attended (I will pick up basic certs on my own) Or WGU?

One of my troops is going to attend Arcadia University when he gets out this year. He is from PA and the university is not far from his hometown. What he has told me is that they are accepting his certifications to add credits towards his degree. He also attended Cisco Academy courses before he joined the service and Arcadia is accepting those as well. With all the CLEPs + DSSTs that he has completed, they informed him that he could earn his BS in less then two year.

The way I look at it, if you have that kind of setup by the time you get out I say why not... you have already earned credits and you aren't starting your College path as a newbie credit-less freshman, a point that people who have been posting seem to miss... but still good information from everybody.

Danielm7

CCNTrainee wrote: »

No offense but not all of us learn effectively doing strictly online schooling. If there is one thing I have noticed the last five years of improving myself, it is that I learn and focus a lot better when I am among peers especially when it comes to boring Gen Art classes. The fact that I can argue and debate with others on a particular subject builds a better understanding, after all nobody is built, raised, or created the same.

Thou to be fair, I would prefer to earn a degree in just completing the classes related to your discipline since I am not a fan of the "Well Rounded" philosophy. But we don't live in that type of system, so it is what it is. Another thing I would like to add, is that I plan on getting a Graduate degree in MIS from Carnegie Mellon when I am ready for that next path in my life, so B+M would increase that chance.

Your points about different learners and working with others are all valid. But, to be clear, WGU makes you do all the general ed classes as well, it's a standard, accredited BS, not just a tech school.

shauncarter1

fusestone wrote: »

Hello.
I'm going back and forth on this I would like some advice particularly if you have knowledge of what employers or HR folks are looking for or how they view degrees.
Currently I am enrolled in an online program at a for profit university that is regionally accredited. All Gen Ed are about to be completed and I will move into the core courses for IT.
That being said I live near a private non profit university that also has an IT program though the school is expensive (28k) a year. Being military I get an amazing discount It will still be a considerable cost on my part from what I am currently paying (but I can swing it without loans). I have applied to the private uni and I have been accepted with all of my Gen Ed completed. I can start the program soon and a majority of it is online.
My question is this: will employers be that much more impressed with the private school degree over the for profit online school that I can justify the eventual cost that i will pay out of pocket?

Thank you for reading. And for any advice.

For profit or non-profit is not very relevant when you are talking about forging a successful degree in IT. If anyone has evidence of any research suggesting otherwise please let me know. I have know way too many folks with very successful IT careers that went for for profits. Likewise, I know folks that are Princeton graduates that have the same jobs earning lesser pay than their colleagues who graduated from state schools. The moral of the story for me is that a degree is only good as YOU make it.

As for the pricing their is significant research that supports non-profit having higher costs. As many have suggested 28k is way to much for an undergrad for all four years to me let, let alone per year. I would jump ship and look at WGU, TESC, and other lower cost options. The risk is definitely not greater than the reward especially if this is all out of pocket for you.

CCNTrainee

Danielm7 wrote: »

Your points about different learners and working with others are all valid. But, to be clear, WGU makes you do all the general ed classes as well, it's a standard, accredited BS, not just a tech school.

Lol, yeah I know you have to take Gen Ed classes regardless, since that is the Education standard for our Country right?? Lol

anoeljr

CCNTrainee wrote: »

Lol, yeah I know you have to take Gen Ed classes regardless, since that is the Education standard for our Country right?? Lol

You know, I've always wondered why we have to take the Gen Ed classes in college when we've spent all of grades 1-12 taking those classes.

ratbuddy

shauncarter1 wrote: »

For profit or non-profit is not very relevant when you are talking about forging a successful degree in IT. If anyone has evidence of any research suggesting otherwise please let me know.

The fact that you left off what school you earned your degrees in, coupled with the fact that you appear to work at three for-profit schools leads me to believe you may have attended a for-profit school or schools. If you're proud enough to list the degrees and dates, why not list the schools as well? Is it because they have a crummy reputation?

I know it's hard for you to be objective since you have a financial interest in the well-being of several for-profit schools, but do you really think they are perceived as equal to non-profits? Like it or not, perception counts for a lot. Yes, hard workers will do well no matter where they went to school, but you can't pretend a degree from a (perceived, fairly or not) predatory diploma mill like University of Phoenix will carry the same weight as even the crappiest state school or regionally accredited non-profit online school.

If you're going to work hard regardless of which school you attend, you might as well go to a school with better per-student education spending, rather than a for-profit which has a typical ratio of 20% profit 20% advertising 60% everything else.

jvrlopez

Did I miss something? Why is a public university not an option? $100k for a school most haven't heard of?

Don't bother with AMU. They cater towards the military and veteran audience because they can smell the $. I registered with their school but never signed up for classes and must have gotten 2 phone calls every day asking me if I needed help in doing so and filing my VA claim.

Finally, using your GI Bill at a private school will only get you a certain amount of benefits vs. going to a public school as a resident.



Public School
All Tuition & Fee Payments for an in-State Student


Private or Foreign School
Up to $18,077.50 per academic year National Maximum (see next table for exceptions)