Turning down job, a Mistake?

TechGromit

So I was informed a few days ago my power station will be closing in October 1, a full year earlier than expected. Anyway there a job opening at another station, same job I'm doing now, if I want it, it's mine, no interview required. The downside no pay increase and it's in Rochester, NY. It's a full ten degrees colder there (on average) and averages over 7 feet of snow a year, I get maybe 6 inches a year tops where I'm at. I'm single (or soon to be) so nothing is holding me back from moving, but I really don't want to move to the Antarctica. Anyone think I'm foolish to turn down this opportunity. While I'm confident I can obtain employment elsewhere, if at all possible, I would prefer to stay working for the major utility I work for. The benefits, bonuses, training are great and management really supports IT. I worked for some crappy employers in the past, were benefits, pay, culture all sucked. Really don't want to get stuck working for another lousy employer again, there are no guarantees another position will become available from now till October. Am I better off sucking it up and taking a sure thing, or hope for another position within the next 8 months?

SteveLavoie

Do you have to answer fast or real soon ? It's not an easy decision. From what I am reading, you like to work there, benefits and management are good.. I would take the job and move to Rochester, NY. For the weather, I understand your concern, I am from Quebec, and it is worse than in upstate NY. Today, it is -20F outside, and since Sunday about 12 inch of snow fell to the ground... However, that's thing you get used to and it can give you the chance to enjoy ski, or other winter sport or just give you other reason to study more and play video games

yoba222

There's no guarantee that the culture and management support of IT at the Rochester plant is the same as it is where you are now.

You could propose making a business trip up to that plant in the next few weeks and working there for a week to get a feel for it. Then you'll know if February in Rochester is tolerable too.

I'd definitely dust off the resume now though.

UnixGuy

I'm not familiar with American states/areas, but since you're soon to be single, maybe a move to a new area and a fresh start is a good idea?

TechGromit

SteveLavoie wrote: »

Do you have to answer fast or real soon ?

Posting closes Sunday, so anytime till then.

yoba222 wrote: »

There's no guarantee that the culture and management support of IT at the Rochester plant is the same as it is where you are now.

It's true site management could be different, corporate management is the same company wide. This is a corporate position, stationed at the site.

UnixGuy wrote: »

I'm not familiar with American states/areas, but since you're soon to be single, maybe a move to a new area and a fresh start is a good idea?

While ten degrees doesn't sound like a big difference, often it means the difference getting snow in the winter, instead of just rain. And roughly one month shorter of warmer weather every year.

Deus Ex Machina

Follow your gut. People here are downplaying issues like the cold weather because, for them, it isn't really a big deal. It might be a much bigger deal for you. You've gotta go with what feels right.

MitM

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

Follow your gut. People here are downplaying issues like the cold weather because, for them, it isn't really a big deal. It might be a much bigger deal for you. You've gotta go with what feels right.

Exactly my thoughts. Well said

EANx

What's the down-side to applying for the Rochester job and then keeping your eye out for something new? You're not really pulling the trigger until they have you move.

TechGromit

EANx wrote: »

What's the down-side to applying for the Rochester job and then keeping your eye out for something new? You're not really pulling the trigger until they have you move.

A year, can't apply for another job for 1 year after accepting a position. Jumping for another job would work if I left the company, but not if I want to remain with the same employer. If I say Yes, I'm committed, can't say I changed my mind before I move.

UnixGuy

TechGromit wrote: »

While ten degrees doesn't sound like a big difference, often it means the difference getting snow in the winter, instead of just rain. And roughly one month shorter of warmer weather every year.

yeah that sucks. I personally don't mind snow but I prefer a more beach kind of weather....I've heard great things about New York..on TV shows

Ertaz

TechGromit wrote: »

A year, can't apply for another job for 1 year after accepting a position. Jumping for another job would work if I left the company, but not if I want to remain with the same employer. If I say Yes, I'm committed, can't say I changed my mind before I move.

Was in a similar position in 09. My corporate IT job was eliminated at the location I was at. The division I was assigned to liked me and offered me a job in Process Control at a location 10 hours south. I took it because the market was so tight back then it felt like my only option. I worked there for a couple months until I was contacted by a company I worked for in the 90’s. That job allowed me to keep my house and work from home.

N7Valiant

How long was it since your last promotion and how impressive is your resume? I don't know what the job market is like where you are, but if your resume has been polished and well stocked over the years, I'd try something else.

You'd also have to figure out cost of living, state/local taxes, maybe longer commute either due to distance or driving through icy roads. Wouldn't do it if they don't bump your pay.

McxRisley

Have you at least spoke to your company about a raise or maybe getting one 6 months after you accept the position? Another tactic is that you could play hard ball with them and refuse to take the job without a pay increase and see what they say. From the sounds of it I don't think you're a contractor but I know in the contracting world you gota be tough and take no **** from companies because they will always try to get you at your bottom dollar if you let them. The same could apply here.

eansdad

Personally, being in southern NJ, I feel your pain on snow. Their are good jobs here with Philly and DE close by. Why limit yourself though. If moving is an option why not look towards warmer climate?

Swift6

Changing jobs is one thing, moving location is another. Plus there are other factors to consider.
Not an easy decision by any measure.

Pick what you feel is right for you. When you accept/turn down a job, you do it for you not the employer.
Take a trip to Rochester and see what it's like. At the same time, keep an eye out for other opportunities in locations favourable to you.

scaredoftests

Go with what your gut says. I would, however, take a trip up to Rochester and take a look around..kick the tires so to speak. Do research, just so you won't kick yourself later.

AD12345

Stay FAR FAR away from Rochester, NY. Source: Rochester NY resident who cant wait to leave once my kids graduate HS. If you think our snowfall rates are high, you should see our property tax rates (usually top 10 in the nation but a few years we were number 1!). Also, good luck finding another job around here if you lose that one, the only places hiring are not places you want to work for. If you can move, move someplace awesome like Austin or Denver, you will be able to find a job in a heartbeat and wind up in a MUCH better place! FYI, if you are going to be working at Ginna, don't expect it to be around too long because right now the only reason it hasn't been shut down is because tax payers are subsidizing it and that probably isn't going to last forever...

LonerVamp

I hate to be that guy, but average snowfall and a slightly lower average temperature are factors? If so, you have bigger issues than this decision. You're not moving, as you mentioned, to Antarctica (or Alaska, sticking to the US...). I can understand *major* climate differences are decent factors for where you go in life, but that difference seems nitpicky.

pirlo21

why don't you ask if you can get a raise first?

TechGromit

AD12345 wrote: »

SIf you think our snowfall rates are high, you should see our property tax rates (usually top 10 in the nation but a few years we were number 1!).

If I do take this position, I have no plans on purchasing a house in the area. it will be a stop gap measure to buy me time until a position I really want opens up, 2 to 3 years at the most.

AD12345 wrote: »

Also, good luck finding another job around here if you lose that one, the only places hiring are not places you want to work for. If you can move, move someplace awesome like Austin or Denver, you will be able to find a job in a heartbeat and wind up in a MUCH better place!

There seems to be plenty of jobs in Washington DC and surrounding areas, I wouldn't mind moving there. It's 4 to 5 degrees warmer year round than where I live in NJ.

AD12345 wrote: »

FYI, if you are going to be working at Ginna, don't expect it to be around too long because right now the only reason it hasn't been shut down is because tax payers are subsidizing it and that probably isn't going to last forever...

This is pretty much true for all Nuclear plants at the moment, so long as the price of natural gas remains low, Nuclear power plants have a tough time making a profit. While one could simply say if they are unprofitable, just close them, the problem is, it takes years to build a new Nuclear power plant, when the price of Natural gas goes back up, which it eventually will given it's a finite resource, people will be paying higher electricity rates in the long run if there were no nuclear plants remaining.

pirlo21 wrote: »

why don't you ask if you can get a raise first?

No raise for a lateral move, it's a moot point. Besides it's really not a question of a few thousand dollars are going to make me want me to move to a colder climate.

Dojiscalper

As someone who recently moved to a better climate I can tell you must be "not enjoying" winter and thinking about some place better. If it were me, soon to be single, I'd do what ever I wanted even if that meant moving far south to a warm beach. Life is to short to be unhappy and climate is something you can change in your life.

YOLO

AD12345

TechGromit wrote: »

If I do take this position, I have no plans on purchasing a house in the area. it will be a stop gap measure to buy me time until a position I really want opens up, 2 to 3 years at the most.

A few of my daughters friend's parents had no intention of sticking around until they met someone, it happens so never say never. It happens a lot more than you think.

TechGromit wrote: »

There seems to be plenty of jobs in Washington DC and surrounding areas, I wouldn't mind moving there. It's 4 to 5 degrees warmer year round than where I live in NJ.

There are way more jobs, but the commute is so horrible and everything is so expensive. Other than that, DC is freaking awesome!

TechGromit wrote: »

This is pretty much true for all Nuclear plants at the moment, so long as the price of natural gas remains low, Nuclear power plants have a tough time making a profit. While one could simply say if they are unprofitable, just close them, the problem is, it takes years to build a new Nuclear power plant, when the price of Natural gas goes back up, which it eventually will given it's a finite resource, people will be paying higher electricity rates in the long run if there were no nuclear plants remaining.

Yeah but here's the thing, if this lawsuit succeeds, and the state supreme court is allowing the lawsuit to proceed, kiss the plant bye bye. https://www.timesunion.com/news/article/Lawsuit-against-nuclear-power-subsidies-will-12525094.php Look, I have lived here for a while. If I could go back in time with what I know now, I wouldnt be anywhere near this place. Its your call, but really, there are sooooo many better options than this place. Just my 2 cents.

ImThe0ne

TechGromit wrote: »

So I was informed a few days ago my power station will be closing in October 1, a full year earlier than expected. Anyway there a job opening at another station, same job I'm doing now, if I want it, it's mine, no interview required. The downside no pay increase and it's in Rochester, NY. It's a full ten degrees colder there (on average) and averages over 7 feet of snow a year, I get maybe 6 inches a year tops where I'm at. I'm single (or soon to be) so nothing is holding me back from moving, but I really don't want to move to the Antarctica. Anyone think I'm foolish to turn down this opportunity. While I'm confident I can obtain employment elsewhere, if at all possible, I would prefer to stay working for the major utility I work for. The benefits, bonuses, training are great and management really supports IT. I worked for some crappy employers in the past, were benefits, pay, culture all sucked. Really don't want to get stuck working for another lousy employer again, there are no guarantees another position will become available from now till October. Am I better off sucking it up and taking a sure thing, or hope for another position within the next 8 months?

I can't say that I have been a similar situation, but I also work IT for one of the nations largest utility providers and can absolutely understand the struggle you are having. The benefits offered seriously make you consider making a bad situation work temporarily until something else comes open internally.

What are the chances that your current company has other jobs you'd like open before Oct 1?
Are you well rooted with other internal teams you'd like to join where you could reach out and see if they have any potential openings?

TechGromit

ImThe0ne wrote: »

What are the chances that your current company has other jobs you'd like open before Oct 1?

Chances of obtaining another position within IT over the next 8 months is actually very good, it's just that it may not be the kind of job I want to be doing. It's been a good 10 years since I had to deal with end user issues.

I did have one the other day, some contractor comes into my cube early in the morning before the IT desk side staff came in. Technically he suppose to call the help desk, open a ticket, wait for someone to come help him. But in IT all too often we help someone out without a ticket because, really who wants to wait around all morning for there computer to get fixed so they can do there job. Anyway he shows me a PS/2 mouse and says it doesn't work, I ask him if he cares what kind of mouse I give him, he says no. I give him an USB mouse. Has says the end is different. I take it back and give him a PS/2 mouse, he putters away and returns 2 minutes later, still doesn't work. I grab the USB mouse, follow him over to his cube plug it in, test it, he's fixed. It's been a good 3 or 4 months since I last had to deal with a user of this technical level, I think I would blow my brains out if I had to deal with that every day again.

Fulcrum45

I must be weird because I love snow. But in Rochester NY? You're not just going to get snow. You're going to get Lake Effect Snow, lol. Would they even offer you relocation assistance if you were to take the job? I would hate to uproot myself just to go somewhere else and do the same job for in climate I don't like. Would you be able to keep your seniority or would you be the low guy on the totem pole? I would be willing to risk the unemployment line and look a bit more local for a job- hopefully you have more time to look.

TechGromit

So I thought this issue was all settled, I tell my manager I'm turning down the position, Case closed. Yesterday I found out another position opened up at the same location, this is a promotion, it's a good 20k more a year, possibly more, larger bonuses too. Not sure if I can keep turning down every opportunity than comes in, after all it's now 7 months till my location closes. I'm giving this job serious consideration, I think I can suffer for 2 or 3 years until something in the south opens up. While my position on the crappy weather hasn't changed, promotions at my level do not come up all that often, and once I'm in this position for at least a year, a lateral move is far easier than getting a promotion. And if worse comes to worse, after a few years, I'll look outside the company. While I can technically look outside the company today for another job, I'm under a retention bonus contractual obligation, until Oct, 2019. If I leave the company before than I have to pay back a 15k bonus and I miss out on another 15k payment. Since both cyber security positions will be vacant within a month, I will have a lot of leverage salary wise.

adam220891

TechGromit wrote: »

So I thought this issue was all settled, I tell my manager I'm turning down the position, Case closed. Yesterday I found out another position opened up at the same location, this is a promotion, it's a good 20k more a year, possibly more, larger bonuses too. Not sure if I can keep turning down every opportunity than comes in, after all it's now 7 months till my location closes. I'm giving this job serious consideration, I think I can suffer for 2 or 3 years until something in the south opens up. While my position on the crappy weather hasn't changed, promotions at my level do not come up all that often, and once I'm in this position for at least a year, a lateral move is far easier than getting a promotion. And if worse comes to worse, after a few years, I'll look outside the company. While I can technically look outside the company today for another job, I'm under a retention bonus contractual obligation, until Oct, 2019. If I leave the company before than I have to pay back a 15k bonus and I miss out on another 15k payment. Since both cyber security positions will be vacant within a month, I will have a lot of leverage salary wise.

As someone who moved 700 miles south, I can confidently say $20k would not be enough to take me to Rochester, NY.

I hate cold weather and gray skies that seem to be relentless November-April. If that matters to you, don't do it. If you think you won't mind, buy a shovel and a car with remote start and enjoy.

hiddenknight821

adam220891 wrote: »

...buy a shovel and a car with remote start and enjoy.

This guy knows exactly what he's talking about! I kept a shovel in the trunk of my car in case of emergency as you can expect the unexpected. Recently got a remote-start installed on my car as we had a few weeks of freezing weather for the first time in a few years.

adam220891

hiddenknight821 wrote: »

This guy knows exactly what he's talking about! I kept a shovel in the trunk of my car in case of emergency as you can expect the unexpected. Recently got a remote-start installed on my car as we had a few weeks of freezing weather for the first time in a few years.

It's just a reality for those living in the NE. Some people love it. Some are indifferent and it's just what happens in the winter. Others, like me, can't stand it and would rather have insufferable swamp ass for half the year.

I'm realistic about where I stand. If it's not a big deal, you're crazy not to take the raise (assuming nothing else is keeping you in an area). But if it is a big deal, think carefully about if it is really worth it.

I'd take it and then get out the ol' resume since it seems like it's not a huge deal for you (then again, maybe it really is).

yoba222

From 16" of snow a year to 83" on average. You state a good case to move considering the promotion, the raise, and your current employment obligations. But visualize shoveling 18 additional feet of snow over those three years.

TechGromit

yoba222 wrote: »

From 16" of snow a year to 83" on average. You state a good case to move considering the promotion, the raise, and your current employment obligations. But visualize shoveling 18 additional feet of snow over those three years.

Yea it's gonna suck, but in the long run I believe will be beneficial. The rents are lower, but I'm sure the heating bills will make up for the difference, As for remote start, a place with a garage is a requirement for me, not dealing with clearing snow and ice off the car in the morning. If I really hate it I just need to stick it out for 18 months till I get my retention bonu$.