Another reason education is so important in this industry...

garv221

I wouldn't say it is the education that creates people like this but the person themselves. The majoty of uneducated people will settle for less & have no desire to hussle to the top (hence no desire for further education), however I know people who are self made multi with no education further than highschool. They just have that mentality to make money. I think alot of people in IT have ego problems as well when it comes to users & their questions/problems. Doctors don't get an attitude with me when I ask questions at a checkup? Engineers also beat problems to death and tend to over think a very simple problem.

Judd

jpeezy55 wrote:

I just hope the degree and certs can land me somewhere better in 2 years (when I finish the BS degree)...

If the current tread stays the course, then you are on the right track. Soon your Admin partner will be forced out because management will realize that he will not be able to pursue further up without more education. This is happening everywhere, this is the fate of the early IT workers with no formal education. Software, PC's, technology is becoming too sophisticated to fully understand without more education (not always the rule but it is objective). Not to mention the interaction skills required of the corporate IT professional. Would you feel comfortable handing over your biggest contract to a director who has never sat for a college exam?

garv221 wrote:

Doctors don't get an attitude with me when I ask questions at a checkup? Engineers also beat problems to death and tend to over think a very simple problem.

Nor do I get an attitude when end-users don't understand the technology, but do you think doctors would be pissed if a colleague can't diagnose a common cold?? I think you've missed my point just a little. But I understand what you intended to convey.

sprkymrk

Judd wrote:

garv221 wrote:

Doctors don't get an attitude with me when I ask questions at a checkup? Engineers also beat problems to death and tend to over think a very simple problem.

Nor do I get an attitude when end-users don't understand the technology, but do you think doctors would be pissed if a colleague can't diagnose a common cold?? I think you've missed my point just a little. But I understand what you intended to convey.

Same here, it's not the fact that the users don't know how to fix something that burns me, it's the ones that continue to download or bring in illegal software, download crappy shareware against company policy or load 100GB of mp3's on their computer and whine that they run out of space and HAVE to have a better computer with a bigger hard drive.

To further the analogy of the doctor, suppose that same doctor told you to go on a diet and quit smoking, but all you wanted to do is take some diet pills. You swear that's all you need and he doesn't know what he's talking about because your neighbor had the exact same thing, etc, etc.

strauchr

jpeezy55 wrote:

But, I agree that education is very important, as is hands-on and actually doing the work. The Admin where I work does not have certs, or a college degree and yet he runs the whole show here, mostly because he was here 4 years prior to getting the Admin job and knows how to do the stuff he needs to do. Granted we run Novell here, and he may not fare too well in a 100% Server 2003 environment, but he would probably hold his own based on having done this stuff for so long.

Thats what I call a technical dinosaur. They are great and 'knowing' their environment but they don't really have the skills and/or knowledge to fruther develop passed that.

I ran into a same situation with these so called 'experts' who knew their NT 4.0 domains inside out but as soon as AD came into play they were completely lost yet still kept that attitude that they knew it all. And to top it off they were complacent with their training/studying so many AD implementations were absoloute disasters but you couldn't tel them that - no it was stupid Microsofts fault.

I hope I never become like that, and doubt I ever will.

garv221

I agree with the both of you on the doctor part and ignoring his advice, but I do know alot of IT people who get pissed and frustrated with users & loose their communication skills when they ask "so called" low level questions. I do think implying your staff is not witty and uneducated because you solved a problem is having an attitude.

Judd

garv221 wrote:

I do think implying your staff is not witty and uneducated because you solved a problem is having an attitude.

Overall the staff is great, we just have a couple of people who are being paid as techs who couldn't be further from that. They honestly belong at the help desk.

People who get upset when others succeed, or don't comprehend an analysis tend to label their peers as a know-it-all, or have an attitude as you mentioned. This isn't the case in this situation. If anyone showed attitude at my process, it was the two who can't understand technical jargon written at the level a tech should understand. This is a simple DOS interpretation of the same process they perform by pointing and clicking every day. Keep in mind, they were the only two who complained...after a solution was provided. The same two who balked about having to change the way they do things. Your perception of the situation as having an attitude isn't completely uncommon, however in this case it is irrelevant.

garv221

Gotcha. I would consider creating an IT policy & procedure manual containing your new method of doing things. Alot of time people will complain until they see it laid out in such a way where they face possible termination for not following the company guidelines. This also helps to stop the constant questions that always shoot your way. You can always say "read the manual". They will now be responsible for their own actions and they can be held accountable for not following what you had simply laid out to them. It will no longer be your fault, but theirs for not following policy.

12thlevelwarrior

i think alittle fear of termination in the workplace is a good thing.