Hello EveryOne Im a Newbie:p

Netaddict

Well I some how came across this site but never the less I'm glad I have found it. This Last month have been very busy for me, trying to decide on how to go about getting into the IT field at
the Age of 28..Network Administration was my Career Goal (Got my first PC in 1994) 386Sx with only DOS lol and 1mb of ram..My first school did not work out, upon me finishing up all my Financial Aid/transcripts/VA info and was just stoaked and motivated to to start this 15 month class they call me and said that the course was removed from the school and did i want to take Respiratory Therapy i just Hung the phone Up and was shocked freaking ATI Career Training.

I was so depressed and sad, but now I'm happy everything went that way anyhow. I started looking at schools again, and settled on Devry IT program, Bachelor of Science in Network and Communications Management. I figured i have just about 4yrs left to use my GIBiLL(Marine Corps) so why not put it to use before it expire. The Admissions guys had some good info for me like looking for a internship and certs while attending school.But I'm just So excited i cant wait school starts in Sept. Ever since i got out of the corps i have not hit a lick at a stick lol, really just working Deadend Jobs that i didn't enjoy..I love PC's how information is exchanged/stored lans /wans servers etc etc ok enough:p Just want to make sure im going about this whole IT career the correct way..Thx

skeet2331

good luck on your schooling and Welcome to the forums.

unclejohnny

Welcome to the forum. Look through all of the different forum topics to get a feel for what is going on in the industry and in the cert world. This site also has great technotes to help study for certs.

Be sure to look at different cert programs: CompTIA, Microsoft, Cisco, etc to see what paths interest you and go from there.

dynamik

Devry seems to get a lot of mixed reviews. I think it's most limiting aspect is that it lacks regional accreditation, which would probably hurt you if you try to go on to a masters. You may wish to do a little more research before you commit all that time and money to them. It seems like they promise more than they can offer in terms of internships, etc. as well. I'm not trying to discourage you. A degree from Devry is certainly better than nothing. I just wanted to bring those things to your attention.

Glad you're on the IT bandwagon. Good luck with your studies!

M@rv1n

Netaddict wrote:

Well I some how came across this site but never the less I'm glad I have found it. This Last month have been very busy for me, trying to decide on how to go about getting into the IT field at
the Age of 28..Network Administration was my Career Goal (Got my first PC in 1994) 386Sx with only DOS lol and 1mb of ram..My first school did not work out, upon me finishing up all my Financial Aid/transcripts/VA info and was just stoaked and motivated to to start this 15 month class they call me and said that the course was removed from the school and did i want to take Respiratory Therapy i just Hung the phone Up and was shocked freaking ATI Career Training.

I was so depressed and sad, but now I'm happy everything went that way anyhow. I started looking at schools again, and settled on Devry IT program, Bachelor of Science in Network and Communications Management. I figured i have just about 4yrs left to use my GIBiLL(Marine Corps) so why not put it to use before it expire. The Admissions guys had some good info for me like looking for a internship and certs while attending school.But I'm just So excited i cant wait school starts in Sept. Ever since i got out of the corps i have not hit a lick at a stick lol, really just working Deadend Jobs that i didn't enjoy..I love PC's how information is exchanged/stored lans /wans servers etc etc ok enough:p Just want to make sure im going about this whole IT career the correct way..Thx

networker050184

Yes M@rv1n, he did say that.....

jryantech

I'm wondering what your first school was... Was it a Technical school like DeVry? Or does it have credits that can transfer to Community/University Colleges?

As dynamik said DeVry gets mixed reviews and the accreditation is not so hot. But I've always said they're some circumstances where DeVry is the right route and this might be one of those circumstances. If you were my age (20) and thinking about DeVry I'd tell you your better off with starting at a Community College and transferring to a University.

My best advice for you is to hit DeVry hard but hit Certs harder. If you have a strong list of Certifications on your resume, the DeVry degree might not look as bad.

And thanks for serving my country.

Netaddict

dynamik wrote:

Devry seems to get a lot of mixed reviews. I think it's most limiting aspect is that it lacks regional accreditation, which would probably hurt you if you try to go on to a masters. You may wish to do a little more research before you commit all that time and money to them. It seems like they promise more than they can offer in terms of internships, etc. as well. I'm not trying to discourage you. A degree from Devry is certainly better than nothing. I just wanted to bring those things to your attention.

Glad you're on the IT bandwagon. Good luck with your studies!

Oh thanks for the info, but if i did my research right Devry has "Regional accreditation"

"At DeVry, we take our academics and degree program offerings seriously. Our respected undergraduate and graduate degree programs set us apart and our regional accreditation confirms the continued quality we deliver to our students. Whether you are attending college for the first time or returning to complete your degree to add to your credentials, DeVry programs can help prepare you to succeed in the workplace. Find out more by visiting the links below"

REGIONAL ACCREDITATION generally applies to what most people consider a "traditional college or university." UCLA, Ohio State, Harvard, and University of Phoenix are all regionally accredited institutions. Historically, these institutions prepared an individual for an advanced degree. In order to do graduate work at many of these institutions, you must have obtained a bachelor degree from another regionally accredited institution

NATIONAL ACCREDITATION generally applies to what most people consider a "vocational college or institution." ITT Tech, Bryman College, and The Art Institute are examples of nationally accredited institutions. National accreditation agencies focus on a specific field of study, for example, Art and Design, Business, or Physical Therapy. Historically, national accreditation agencies review institutions that have a career-focused curriculum.

I also called the school again to make sure and they said yes DeVry is Regional Accreditation as every major state University unlike (Example) ITT Tech which has National Accreditation thx for all your help also...And if I'm not correct please inform me:p Oh and that school i first was going to attend was ATI career Training, i should of done More Research on it. Thanks for the compliment on serving, I'd do it all over again if i had too, great experience..
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jryantech

Netaddict please understand that DeVry is a for-profit school. You can search the web for a lot of bad reviews and good reviews.

The discussion about University Education and Technical Education is a bit played out on this forum but here are some:

http://www.techexams.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=21127&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=50
http://www.techexams.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=35189

Very good points made in both of those.

I honestly might even recommend getting an A.S. degree from a Community College if you have one locally. DeVry is expensive but if you can get it paid for then go for it.

loxleynew

Hey, welcome to the forums

From my experiences in IT and watching other people in IT there seems to be a general theme. Certs > degree. I know of tons of people who had really good IT jobs, like cisco people and system/network admins, even programmers without getting a degree in computer related work at all.

If your resume has lots of certs and some actual experience then your set. Getting a degree is a plus, but I would definatley say certs and work experience are the two most important parts.

Sounds like your interested in a network admin job? If so get some desktop help exp while getting some certs such as network+, mcsa ect.

Good luck!

jryantech

aaronmac5 wrote:

Hey, welcome to the forums

From my experiences in IT and watching other people in IT there seems to be a general theme. Certs > degree. I know of tons of people who had really good IT jobs, like cisco people and system/network admins, even programmers without getting a degree in computer related work at all.

If your resume has lots of certs and some actual experience then your set. Getting a degree is a plus, but I would definatley say certs and work experience are the two most important parts.

Sounds like your interested in a network admin job? If so get some desktop help exp while getting some certs such as network+, mcsa ect.

Good luck!

I have to disagree here. Do not think certs and experience will open doors, you'll wind up at an entry level job for a very long time. Just do this yourself...

Go to monster.com, careerbuilder.com and dice.com and look up Network Administration.

Here are two I just found in about 1 minute:

TriQuint is looking for an experienced Network Administrator for the Florida division. The right candidate is a self-starter with a passion for technology. Also required is a strong commitment to customer service, good teamwork and the ability to manage multiple priorities and commitments. The right candidate will have strong networking and network management skills, be dependable, flexible and ‘user friendly’. This position is will be part of a global team of IT professionals. Excellent teamwork, communication and documentation skills are essential to succeed in this environment. Mastery of Microsoft networking and server technologies, including AD and Exchange is a must. Cisco router/switch experience and LANDesk experience is strongly desired. Experience with Cisco IP Telephony is a plus.

Microsoft Technologies
Active Directory
Setup/troubleshoot AD group policies
Active Directory administration (create users, groups, etc)
Setup AD sites and site links
Organizational Unit management
Exchange
Administer Exchange (create mailboxes, public folders, aliases, custom recipients, etc)
Setup/troubleshoot Exchange servers
Backup and restore mailboxes, information stores and servers
DNS

DHCP

Server Clustering

IIS setup and maintenance

Network Management

LANDesk or related management tools
Create MSI files and push auto-install packages
Firewall setup and maintenance
IDS experience
Symantec Corporate Antivirus software (push definitions, setup alerts, etc)

Networking
SAN Experience (deploy and maintain)
VMWare Experience
TCP/IP addressing, sub-netting and routing
Cisco router and layer 2/3 switch configuration including QoS, OSPF, VLAN and spanning tree
Configuration and troubleshooting of 802.11b/g wireless networks
Troubleshoot networks using Fluke Optiview, Sniffer or other troubleshooting tool/packet analyzer
Cisco IP phone system experience a plus
Job Requirements
An BA or BS degree in computer science or related field is required (or 10 years of equivalent experience)
MCSE certification preferred
Net+ Certification preferred
CCNA Certification desired
Experience maintaining a network with 300 or more nodes
Experience maintaining WAN links to multiple other sites (three or more)

# Bachelor's degree from a four year college or university in Computer Science, Information Technology or Network Engineering. Qualified candidates should have proven analytical/reasoning and communication skills.
# Must have 3-5 years experience in information systems in the following or the equivalent combination of education and experience:
# Managing and maintaining Cisco Routers, Switches, Load Balancers and Firewalls
# Implementing and troubleshooting network/internet Protocols/Services such as:
# GigE, 10/100 Ethernet, OSPF, EIGRP, BGP, DNS, TCP/IP, IPSec and NAT
# Network management/monitoring tools and protocol analyzers
# Wireless networking products such as 802.11x in an enterprise environment
# Network related products such as PIX, ASA, VPN, RADIUS and Active Directory.
# Remote access (IPSec and SSL VPN) technologies
# Leading medium to small technical projects with demonstrated oral and written ability to communicate with team members
# CCNA certificate required.
# CCNP certificate preferred

In my opinion a Degree, Certifications and Experience are all needed.

dynamik

Do you have a link for their regional accreditation? That's the most important one to have (national is more for specialty schools, like flight school), and they do not list it on their accreditation page: http://www.devry.edu/whydevry/accreditation.jsp

Also, check out this page: http://www.devry.edu/whydevry/approvals.jsp Some of those really don't look too good. Minnesota doesn't seem to take too well to them, which might be why I don't think they have a great reputation. Check your state on that list.

You might want to look into Capella and/or WGU as well:
http://www.capella.edu/about_capella/accreditation.aspx
http://www.wgu.edu/about_WGU/accreditation.asp

networker050184

jryantech wrote:

I have to disagree here. Do not think certs and experience will open doors, you'll wind up at an entry level job for a very long time.

Have anything to back this up? If I remember correctly you are searching for an entry level job yourself.....

jryantech

networker050184 wrote:

jryantech wrote:

I have to disagree here. Do not think certs and experience will open doors, you'll wind up at an entry level job for a very long time.

Have anything to back this up? If I remember correctly you are searching for an entry level job yourself.....

I never said that having certs and experience will NOT open doors. Just do not think they will, because having that mentality will make you second guess the importance of a degree.

And yes I'm searching for an entry level job right now and I'm stuck with Firedog at Circuit City because I do NOT have a degree yet. Although I have gotten interviews and call backs from decent entry level jobs but they all wind up going with someone with more experience. (One employer the guy even told me "If I did not have this recent graduate apply here, I would hire you for the spot but I have to go with the more experience. I hope you understand."). And yes I did mess up on two of the five interviews, I'm not going to lie, but thats just the name of the game.

So I guess you can say I have something to back it up. But common sense will tell someone that a degree, certifications and experience are better then certifications and experience.

undomiel

jryantech wrote:

I never said that having certs and experience will NOT open doors. Just do not think they will, because having that mentality will make you second guess the importance of a degree.

Personally it is all about having the right attitude and skills to go and open those doors yourself. If you go into that interview with the attitude that you are being held back by not having a degree then yes that will hold you back. Ditch the attitude and that interview will be a lot easier for you.

And yes I'm searching for an entry level job right now and I'm stuck with Firedog at Circuit City because I do NOT have a degree yet.

So you searched for an entry level job and you found an entry level job. Without a degree. What's the problem here? Of course there are other possibly better entry level jobs available as well. Score the interview and go in and knock their socks off with how well you can do the work for them. Then they won't care that you do not have a degree.

So I guess you can say I have something to back it up. But common sense will tell someone that a degree, certifications and experience are better then certifications and experience.

I disagree. That isn't common sense. It is just mimicking the line handed to you by the job descriptions.

Voice of dissidence closed here. Carry on.

networker050184

It seems you would need to see at least one door opened firsthand before you can give advice on what opens doors to people.....

I and many other people I know do not have degrees and were not stuck in an entry level job for a "very long time."

I agree that a degree is very important in any field, but to say with out one you will be stuck in entry level (especially with out experiencing this yourself) is just bad and incorrect advice.

loxleynew

I agree a degree is important. My point was that a degree in IT means almost nothing if you have the experience/cert. I have a bachelors in sports exercise and currently am in the IT field (not entry level pos.)

The degree jump starts your career in IT is from what ive seen. I am not sure of what a degree would relate to in terms of cert/eperience.

I think in the long run a degree wont hurt you. However start getting certs and an entry level job asap. A degree(unless it's specificaly for like programming) mainly shows character.

loxleynew

networker050184 wrote:

I agree that a degree is very important in any field, but to say with out one you will be stuck in entry level (especially with out experiencing this yourself) is just bad and incorrect advice.

/agree 100%

Netaddict

dynamik wrote:

Do you have a link for their regional accreditation? That's the most important one to have (national is more for specialty schools, like flight school), and they do not list it on their accreditation page: http://www.devry.edu/whydevry/accreditation.jsp

Also, check out this page: http://www.devry.edu/whydevry/approvals.jsp Some of those really don't look too good. Minnesota doesn't seem to take too well to them, which might be why I don't think they have a great reputation. Check your state on that list.

You might want to look into Capella and/or WGU as well:
http://www.capella.edu/about_capella/accreditation.aspx
http://www.wgu.edu/about_WGU/accreditation.asp

http://www.devry.edu/whydevry/75th_anniversary.jsp 1981, Like i said i want it all, i want my Certs and my degree with with some Internship while im in School. Yea i know its not cheap, but
i have just about 54k (i put $1800 instead of $1200 for my GI bill) left in my GI Bill which expires may 22 2012, back in 2002 will attending CC it was $1038, direct deposit Rate for my $1500 for 36 Month Full time student..


Like i stated early, I want Certs, and internships while I'm in school, this was never a "Cert vs Degree" issue u cant go wrong with both in my opinion with some internship will in school to get some more Experience..

loxleynew

What cert are you going for to start with?

Netaddict

I was thinking either Network+ or A+ as a starting point after being in school a while..i know the recruiter talked about CCNA Certs as while.

snadam

certs vs degree?!?!?!?

Mishra

You guys are so passionate about having or not having a degree. lol

undomiel

Mmmm I would say it is more about the attitude than anything. I have a low tolerance for it.

Mishra

snadam wrote:

certs vs degree?!?!?!?

or more like

networker050184

I do not like when people try to tell others that they can not make it or even get an entry level job in IT without a degree. This is just flat out wrong.

jryantech

networker050184 wrote:

I do not like when people try to tell others that they can not make it or even get an entry level job in IT without a degree. This is just flat out wrong.

I hope this is not pointing towards me because I have never said such a thing.

I do believe though it will be harder too land a (good) IT job without a degree.
And if you disagree with that, then well, we are on different pages.

People without degrees will claim degrees mean nothing, and people with degrees will claim they mean everything. As I said this is a double edged sword and I'm only voicing my opinion. And my opinion is to better yourself with a degree.

Now go to DeVry, work on those certs and keep a good attitude as some have mentioned on here.

networker050184

No, not pointed directly at you, but you did say that with out a degree you will be stuck in an entry level position for a very long time, which is also flat out wrong. When you get into the field and get a few years under your belt you can see for yourself

learningtofly22

Netaddict wrote:

dynamik wrote:

Do you have a link for their regional accreditation? That's the most important one to have (national is more for specialty schools, like flight school), and they do not list it on their accreditation page: http://www.devry.edu/whydevry/accreditation.jsp

Also, check out this page: http://www.devry.edu/whydevry/approvals.jsp Some of those really don't look too good. Minnesota doesn't seem to take too well to them, which might be why I don't think they have a great reputation. Check your state on that list.

You might want to look into Capella and/or WGU as well:
http://www.capella.edu/about_capella/accreditation.aspx
http://www.wgu.edu/about_WGU/accreditation.asp

http://www.devry.edu/whydevry/75th_anniversary.jsp 1981, Like i said i want it all, i want my Certs and my degree with with some Internship while im in School. Yea i know its not cheap, but
i have just about 54k (i put $1800 instead of $1200 for my GI bill) left in my GI Bill which expires may 22 2012, back in 2002 will attending CC it was $1038, direct deposit Rate for my $1500 for 36 Month Full time student..


Like i stated early, I want Certs, and internships while I'm in school, this was never a "Cert vs Degree" issue u cant go wrong with both in my opinion with some internship will in school to get some more Experience..

Welcome to the forums, DevilDog! One question, when did you get out of the Corps? I'm guessing around 2002 since your MGIB expires 2012. If you've served for 3 years after 9/11, or got out after 9/11 as a disabled vet, Pres. Bush just signed a SWEET upgrade to the MGIB. Even if you didn't serve a full 3 years after 9/11, you can still get a percentage of the benefits (40% for 90 days of active service after 9/11). Only downside is it doesn't start until Aug 2009, however, it does extend your MGIB expiration by 5 years as well. This drastically changes my college picture, that's for sure! I'll be applying to one of the "southern ivies" next year b/c of this, where I wouldn't have had a chance at affording it before. The new GI Bill pays up to 100% of the most expensive tuition in your state, PLUS $1000 a year for books, PLUS BAH for your zip code if you're in school full time(no distance learning though, but with BAH you can take a pay cut to go to school)!!!!! Take a look at this link, I really hope it applies to you too.

http://www.gibill.va.gov/S22/Post_911_Factsheet.pdf


Semper fi, even if you are a grimy devil dog, haha!


V/R
ET2(SW/MTS) Conner, USN 1999-2007

Tech109

Bottom line: Certs and/or degree will get you the interview. Experience will get you the job. The person interviewing you will know whether or not your really know your stuff by how you respond to the technical questions. You can't BS your way through an interview if the person conducting it knows their tech.

If you're looking for an entry-level helpdesk job, they'll cut you some slack as long as they know you can problem-solve and troubleshoot. For higher-up jobs, even desktop support, they want to know that you've actually worked with the technology in a similar environment.

It's the same in other tech fields, like programming and engineering.

ULWiz

Hey i just wanted to post my two thoughts on Devry.
I am currently myself enrolled in the Devry program for Network and Communications Management. Their course related material for this program geared out of the Cisco Odum books. I have completed a ton of my networking classes and cant say anything bad about them at all. They prepared me for my Network+ Cert quite well. Right now i am taking the WAN implementations class and have learned a bunch about the different technologies and how to configure your router for it.Yes they are a accredited University at this point and not just a tech school like they where back in the day.

THe material they cover is right on course with studying for your CCNA and i cant say one bad thing about them at all. You will have weekly Elearning labs configuring routers etc from BGP OSPF,RIP,PPP,ISDN connections. If the router is not configured correctly the lab will not say your done. So you will get a ton of labs to do while in this class.