UNIX=CISCO=Microsoft holy crap! dirty

astorrs

eMeS wrote: »

Also, FWIW, most state-level CIOs or CIOs of state departments are political appointees, which is really a totally different ballgame. You might never see a state CIO leading any kind of significant organization outside of state government.

Politics. Sshmolitics. I avoid it at all costs.

ccie15672

wait... before the thread dies...

How exactly did Cisco rip of Unix? Pipe? Is that it?

You people are weak.

dynamik

Claymoore wrote: »

FWIW, I just use the 'Ignore List'.

http://www.techexams.net/forums/profile.php?do=ignorelist

Ok. I haven't read this thread yet. I'm going to first read it with ignore on, using my imagination, and then with it off. I wonder which one will be crazier...

ccie15672 wrote: »

wait... before the thread dies...

How exactly did Cisco rip of Unix? Pipe? Is that it?

You people are weak.

ASCII text, noob

msteinhilber

Yeah yeah yeah, smash MS, smash Unix, smash all of those idiot CIO's all you want...

You all fail to see the BIG PICTURE.

The REAL CRIMINALS here are everybody company that builds anything with microprocessors, semiconductors, etc. After all, they all clearly stole the idea of using silicon chips from Jack Kilby and Robert Noyce.

tiersten

dynamik wrote: »

ASCII text, noob

I prefer EBCDIC personally. AS/400 4evar!

eMeS

astorrs wrote: »

Politics. Sshmolitics. I avoid it at all costs.

Me too, I generally avoid state government work at all costs...

blargoe

While we're at it, I'm mad at VMWare for ripping off Microsoft's blue screen of death. Come on, who are you fooling by coloring it purple!

HeroPsycho

ccie15672 wrote: »

wait... before the thread dies...

How exactly did Cisco rip of Unix? Pipe? Is that it?

You people are weak.

Don't you get it? MS stole from *them*! Both of them had object based shells!

Oh... right... neither are...

astorrs

blargoe wrote: »

While we're at it, I'm mad at VMWare for ripping off Microsoft's blue screen of death. Come on, who are you fooling by coloring it purple!

Oh whatever a PSOD is so different from a BSOD. I mean one uses a secondary color for the background while the other just uses a lame primary color. Completely different.

astorrs

tiersten wrote: »

I prefer EBCDIC personally. AS/400 4evar!

Well that confirms my suspicions... you're obviously insane.

Professor: "So the American government went to IBM to come up with an encryption standard, and they came up with—"
Student: "EBCDIC!"

Slowhand

ccie15672 wrote: »

wait... before the thread dies...

How exactly did Cisco rip of Unix? Pipe? Is that it?

You people are weak.

Well, considering the fact that the original implementation of the Cisco IOS was nothing more than a modified version of Unix with a set of routing-specific commands, (and the first couple of routers were, at their heart, just computers with routing-specific components installed,) it's not a stretch to say that the IOS is Unix-like. Then again, since the original version of Unix created at Bell Labs all those years ago isn't around anymore either, you could technically say that all current implementations of Unix-like operating systems - including Linux, the various BSDs, Solaris, etc. - are "ripping of Unix". Back in the day, Microsoft was so afraid of appearing to be stealing from Unix that they changed their traceroute program to be called tracert, in the hopes of avoiding legal action.

I think enough time has passed that what the Cisco IOS started out as has come far enough to be considered its own unique environment, as have the *NIX and Windows operating systems. True, various vendors/platforms borrow from each other, but that's only natural; if something works and is used by a lot of people, everyone's going to want to use it in their product. And, quite frankly, with the amount of times I type ls in a DOS prompt or dir in a Bash window, I'm happy that there's overlap or I'd go completely nuts. Never mind the fact that PoSh not only supports many common system commands from both Windows and *NIX, it also reminds you of how you'd run that command using its own verb-noun syntax each and every time you use any of them. Doesn't stop me from forgetting if I'm hammering my keyboard on a Windows machine, a Linux box, or a Cisco router, but I like the cross-platform command-support regardless.

I think that was what ITDaddy was saying to begin with, how nice it is to have so many familiar commands (or aliases) in an environment like the PoSh prompt. Now, if only Microsoft and the various flavors of *NIX would add some show commands to their CLIs, I'd never know what system I was working on at any given time of the day.

eMeS

astorrs wrote: »

Well that confirms my suspicions... you're obviously insane.

Professor: "So the American government went to IBM to come up with an encryption standard, and they came up with—"
Student: "EBCDIC!"

You guys with your ebc DIC jokes are hilarious.

Never thought I would see EBCDIC mentioned on here, much less used humorously...

MS

eMeS

BTW, I invented the "forum post", so you're all ripping me off.

You all owe me $1 for every post you've ever made. I'm sending BSA to collect since when you've signed up for any forum you implicitly agreed to this and any shrink-wrap license that goes with it.

MS

shednik

eMeS wrote: »

BTW, I invented the "forum post", so you're all ripping me off.

You all owe me $1 for every post you've ever made. I'm sending BSA to collect since when you've signed up for any forum you implicitly agreed to this and any shrink-wrap license that goes with it.

MS

Oh boy you will be making a lot of money off of dynamik

shednik

Slowhand wrote: »

I think that was what ITDaddy was saying to begin with, how nice it is to have so many familiar commands (or aliases) in an environment like the PoSh prompt. Now, if only Microsoft and the various flavors of *NIX would add some show commands to their CLIs, I'd never know what system I was working on at any given time of the day.

Nah, I just think he has a thing for ranting.

JDMurray

Slowhand wrote: »

Back in the day, Microsoft was so afraid of appearing to be stealing from Unix that they changed their traceroute program to be called tracert, in the hopes of avoiding legal action.

This particular rename was to conform to the limitation of the FAT's 8.3 file system naming convention. None of the UNIX command names are trademarked and they are too short to copyright.

Don't forget that Microsoft was once a UNIX shop. MS licensed Xenix and, at one time, performed most of their software development using the Xenix platform. The design of MS-DOS 2.0 (and later) borrowed heavily from UNIX as it moved away from the design of CP/M.

Ah, Bell Labs Version 7 UNIX...good times...

tiersten

Slowhand wrote: »

Well, considering the fact that the original implementation of the Cisco IOS was nothing more than a modified version of Unix with a set of routing-specific commands, (and the first couple of routers were, at their heart, just computers with routing-specific components installed,)

IOS was never a modified version of UNIX. You're thinking of Juniper hardware and JunOS which has FreeBSD at its core.

Slowhand wrote: »

Then again, since the original version of Unix created at Bell Labs all those years ago isn't around anymore either, you could technically say that all current implementations of Unix-like operating systems - including Linux, the various BSDs, Solaris, etc. - are "ripping of Unix".

The descendants of UNIX are still around and still contain original UNIX code. BSD, Solaris and others can't be "ripping off UNIX" because of that. UNIX family tree.

mrmcmint

skrpune wrote: »

Um, isn't this the "Microsoft sucks" thread and not the "CIOs are stupid thread"?? I'm confused.

Anywho, PUHLEASE, can we let this just die? Pretty please? We get it - you think Microsoft is stealing from everyone else and Microsoft is evil, and you think that CIOs are all stupid and nontechnical and therefore entirely inept at their jobs. I'm pretty sure the horse is dead, no need to beat it any further.

Agreed - silly thread!

HeroPsycho

skrpune wrote: »

I'm pretty sure the horse is dead, no need to beat it any further.

But I got a gun and a poking stick!

dynamik

shednik wrote: »

Oh boy you will be making a lot of money off of dynamik

So you're saying MS is my pimp?

gojericho0

dynamik wrote: »

So you're saying MS is my pimp?

or to put it another way...you are MS's b- ...oh nevermind

ccie15672

tiersten wrote: »

IOS was never a modified version of UNIX. You're thinking of Juniper hardware and JunOS which has FreeBSD at its core.


The descendants of UNIX are still around and still contain original UNIX code. BSD, Solaris and others can't be "ripping off UNIX" because of that. UNIX family tree.

You beat me to it.

Cisco IOS was based on the "NOS" operating system which was originally developed from scratch by William Yeager at Stanford. He wrote it from scratch in C and assembler on a DEC PDP 11/05. It was later ported to a custom 68000 based platform developed at Stanford. Much of NOS remained in the original Cisco IOS. In fact, Stanford licensed NOS to Cisco for their IOS.

There was no command-line editing in Cisco IOS until v9.21.

IOS-XE and IOS-XR are newer version of IOS which indeed are based on *nix kernels. This no secret, anymore than the fact that JUNOS is based on FreeBSD.

tiersten

ccie15672 wrote: »

IOS-XE and IOS-XR are newer version of IOS which indeed are based on *nix kernels.

Yeah. I forgot about XE/XR.

IOS-XR = QNX RTOS which got a POSIX API grafted onto it awhile ago.
IOS-XE = Linux kernel.

Neither are actually a Unix or Unix descendant but actually Unix-like OSes aka *nix. There is a difference and if you don't think so then I'm sure SCO would like to talk to you

Slowhand

Heh, I guess I needed some double-checking. Either way, it's not unreasonable to think similar features will appear on multiple platforms. (The "ripping off Unix" comment was meant to be sarcastic; kind of like saying all movie studios that make cartoons are "ripping off Disney".)

Thanks for the clarifications on various topics, guys. I've got to get this network overhaul finished so I can stop working the dusk-till-dawn shift.

ccie15672

Slowhand wrote: »

Either way, it's not unreasonable to think similar features will appear on multiple platforms.

You said it brother. Which makes the whole intellectual property bit a complete farce. I hate to say it, but those lines that the character of Bill Gates spoke in "Pirates of Silicon Valley"....

"Get real, would ya? You and I are both like guys who had this rich neighbor - Xerox - who left the door open all the time. And you go sneakin' in to steal a TV set. Only when you get there, you realize that I got there first. I got the loot, Steve! And you're yellin'? "That's not fair. I wanted to try to steal it first." You're too late."

....say so much. Not about Gates in particular, but about IT innovation in general. Everything is derivative. Get over it!

eMeS

Now that I think about this, the real lesson to be learned here is that Xerox sucks.

MS

eMeS

gojericho0 wrote: »

or to put it another way...you are MS's b- ...oh nevermind

You're both bitches

msteinhilber

eMeS wrote: »

You're both bitches

I knew after 3 pages this post would finally provide entertainment.

Alif_Sadida_Ekin

I'm surprised the OP hasn't chimed in on all these wonderful, well thought out opinions.

eMeS

Alif_Sadida_Ekin wrote: »

I'm surprised the OP hasn't chimed in on all these wonderful, well thought out opinions.

AlexRoemer