MCSA Security Journey: 290

Bl8ckr0uter

Well after a kind gift from Robert TechExams.net IT Certification Forums - View Profile: RobertKaucher (thanks again by the way) I have way more material than I though I was going to have. At any rate my plan is to sit the 290 within 1 month from Monday (april 15th). My material for the 290 will be as follows:

290 Study guide (MS academy)
290 Lab manual (MS academy)
Sybex guide
MCSE Core in a NuShell

2 Server 2003 images
1 windows 7 image (which will care over into 680)

I will use this thread to keep track of notes and such and track my progress towards my goal (the MCSA Security)

Bl8ckr0uter

I have nearly completed chapter 1 of the study guide and I want to read up to chapter 3 today. I nuked my images and will start fresh with new virtual box machines later on. So far the book has been some mostly review but I know that will change quickly. I don't have a lot of windows knowledge so the learning curve my be steep. Hopefully I should be able to pick up quickly.

dynamik

You really should go for the MCSE. The PKI material in 293 are really important security concepts. With 291 and 293 out of the way, there really isn't much more material for 298 and 299, so that just leaves 294. Honestly, a solid understanding of AD design and group policy will go a long way for you as well.

Bl8ckr0uter

dynamik wrote: »

You really should go for the MCSE. The PKI material in 293 are really important security concepts. With 291 and 293 out of the way, there really isn't much more material for 298 and 299, so that just leaves 294. Honestly, a solid understanding of AD design and group policy will go a long way for you as well.

Dude don't say that lol !!!! I was just thinking about it myself , if I want to go all the way or not(how many more test it would be ).

Like literally I was just thinking about that myself. I am just not sure if I will be able to get 290, 291, 293, 294, 680, 298 ,299 (or 351) and S+ L+ and take a short at SNRS by the end of the year or so. I am not sure how difficult the test are. I mean who knows, the 290 could take me 3 weeks or a month or much longer. We will see how I feel after 290, 291, 680, and 299 (or 351) and S+. If I haven't gone crazy I might just go ahead and pull the trigger on the other ones. Maybe....

I could adjust some timing and such but for now, it is more like a wait and see. MCSA:S is going to be my goal, MCSE:S might be a bonus....

dynamik

What you also need to consider is how much less known the MCSA is compared to the MCSE. If you're looking at going down the Cisco path and aren't going to do the MCSE, you might want to reevaluate the time your dedicating to this Microsoft stuff. 290 is one of the easier ones, and will make you a "Microsoft Certified Professional" if you want to add a Microsoft line to your resume. You may not want to go further than that though. Just get Server 2003 (or 200 Inside Out and go through that and be familiar with the material if you're just interested in it. You don't need to get certs for things you aren't going to use a lot.

Bl8ckr0uter

dynamik wrote: »

What you also need to consider is how much less known the MCSA is compared to the MCSE. If you're looking at going down the Cisco path and aren't going to do the MCSE, you might want to reevaluate the time your dedicating to this Microsoft stuff. 290 is one of the easier ones, and will make you a "Microsoft Certified Professional" if you want to add a Microsoft line to your resume. You may not want to go further than that though. Just get Server 2003 (or 200 Inside Out and go through that and be familiar with the material if you're just interested in it. You don't need to get certs for things you aren't going to use a lot.

It isn't that I don't want to do anything else besides cisco, what it is simply wanting to get into security and Windows does have the largest install base out of the major OSes so I know I will have to work with it at some point. There is just so much that I want to learn/do and it is hard to try to pin it all down.

I do see your point though and I know the MCSA is less known than the MCSE. I will see how I feel after 290 and if I want to keep going, I will, if not then I won't. MCSA Security and CCNA Security just had such a good ring together in my head, MCSE:Security and CCSP sound better and will probably get me further towards what I want to do while still making me marketable.

Psoasman

I would definitely do the MCSE track. I wasn't sure at first if I wanted to, after getting the MCSA, but I am glad I did. there is a lot amount of information that will carry over to other tracks from the MCSE.

by the way, I have some nice hands-on labs for Server 2003 covering everything from AD, PKI, security, you name it. PM your email if you want 'em.

Bl8ckr0uter

Well getting virtualbox to work on centos has been, less than fun but getting virtualbox to work on Ubuntu took 3 clicks, now I see why they call it "noob linux" lol at any rate, I have a server 2003 install (R2) going now and I will probably do one more on my ubuntu box. I then will probably get one on my centos box. I seriously need a new computer but that will have to wait. I am working my way through the first couple of chapters and then I will be ready to hit the lab manual.

petedude

I'm going to be a lone voice of dissent here on this one.

I think it's of value to have a basic Microsoft certification such as an MCSA, but I think at this late date with the 2003 exams retiring soon one should shift focus to earning the MCITP after finishing an MCSA.

Mind you, the MCSA exams will definitely not be a waste-- I don't believe DNS is covered to the same degree on the 2008 track, for example. I'm just not sure it's worth the energy to get an MCSE when the MCITP will become the predominant certification before long-- and that day is just around the corner, arriving faster than most of us realize.

RobertKaucher

Thanks for the shout out.

I forgot you are HW deficient as well. I have a really old NetServ that is sitting on my work bench. I should have brought it for you. My wife would have been happy to see it go.

I agree with Dynamik about the MCSE. Consider this: 270/290 are nearly the same test, 291/293 are nearly the same test 299/298 are nearly the same test. Add in the Sec+ and you have the MCSE Security. The real factor is cost...

If you don't have any real hands on with Server 2003 then it might be a bit harder on you. But I say take the 270/290 within a week of each other and about the same on the others providing you pass the first with a decent score. If you only pass the 291 with a 700, I would not be rushing off to schedule the 293, for example.

veritas_libertas

dynamik wrote: »

You really should go for the MCSE. The PKI material in 293 are really important security concepts. With 291 and 293 out of the way, there really isn't much more material for 298 and 299, so that just leaves 294. Honestly, a solid understanding of AD design and group policy will go a long way for you as well.

What do you think about the security concepts in the MCITP:EA? I know that there really isn't a 298 like certification test for the MCITP paths.

Bl8ckr0uter

petedude wrote: »

I'm going to be a lone voice of dissent here on this one.

I think it's of value to have a basic Microsoft certification such as an MCSA, but I think at this late date with the 2003 exams retiring soon one should shift focus to earning the MCITP after finishing an MCSA.

Mind you, the MCSA exams will definitely not be a waste-- I don't believe DNS is covered to the same degree on the 2008 track, for example. I'm just not sure it's worth the energy to get an MCSE when the MCITP will become the predominant certification before long-- and that day is just around the corner, arriving faster than most of us realize.

I plan to go MCSA:S > MCITP:EA (not sure when I will pick this up, if ever).

Consider this though, I have some (not a whole lot) but some Win Server 2003/XP experience (from the user side and the IT side). I have no windows 2008 experience. I am willing to be that the majority of business have not move to 2008 yet and are still using 2003/XP, and even some vista boxes. Having a basic understanding of what is out there now will only help me with what is to come (imo). I could be wrong but that is just how I feel. I am also installing a vb image for a server 2008 box so it isn't like I am completely ignoring it.

Bl8ckr0uter

RobertKaucher wrote: »

Thanks for the shout out.

No problem. These books are actually very easy to read and quite enjoyable. Some of the cisco books I have read made me want to fall asleep..

RobertKaucher wrote: »

I agree with Dynamik about the MCSE. Consider this: 270/290 are nearly the same test, 291/293 are nearly the same test 299/298 are nearly the same test. Add in the Sec+ and you have the MCSE Security. The real factor is cost...

...and Time. I should mention that I am only using this to pad my resume and broaden out my skillset. I think that for me to go out and do the MCSE with very limited experience would be bad. Put a different way, I don't think I could accurately represent my skills in an interview (and on the job) if I came in as an MCSE vs an MCSA (if this makes sense).


Who knows though, I might change my mind and do the MCSE:S, only time will tell. Honestly a lot more than a MCP is riding on the 290 for me...

RobertKaucher

knwminus wrote: »

Who knows though, I might change my mind and do the MCSE:S, only time will tell. Honestly a lot more than a MCP is riding on the 290 for me...

Change your mind? You don't do that, do you?

Just to throw in my 2 bits with the resume padding thing.

I can understand what you are saying about the experience level. And considering what you seem to be leaning to (Cisco and security in general) a full MCSE may not be important.

I hardly cracked the MOAC book for the 290. I mostly used the Nutshell book. But I had a bit of experience with Server 2003, though not as much as I would have liked.

RobertKaucher

veritas_libertas wrote: »

What do you think about the security concepts in the MCITP:EA? I know that there really isn't a 298 like certification test for the MCITP paths.

I know it was not directed at me, but I have to say I think it's a joke. I imagine it is enough for the typical admin/MS engineer and I don't think the MCSE:Sec was ever really valued, so MS ditched it. Since they are focusing on job roles I believe MS just didn't think it held value for them. That's what CISSP et al are for, I guess. All just my opinion.

veritas_libertas

RobertKaucher wrote: »

I know it was not directed at me, but I have to say I think it's a joke. I imagine it is enough for the typical admin/MS engineer and I don't think the MCSE:Sec was ever really valued, so MS ditched it. Since they are focusing on job roles I believe MS just didn't think it held value for them. That's what CISSP et al are for, I guess. All just my opinion.

I think that is completely legitimate answer Robert. I was thinking about purchasing a 298 book to just read. Now I think that might be a waste of money. I will stick with reading up on Server 2008 since I will be working on the MCITP:EA as soon I can.

Bl8ckr0uter

RobertKaucher wrote: »

Change your mind? You don't do that, do you?

Just to throw in my 2 bits with the resume padding thing.

I can understand what you are saying about the experience level. And considering what you seem to be leaning to (Cisco and security in general) a full MCSE may not be important.

I hardly cracked the MOAC book for the 290. I mostly used the Nutshell book. But I had a bit of experience with Server 2003, though not as much as I would have liked.

lol nope never.

But my whole thing is not to be paper certified, in anything, ever. I'd almost rather not have it than to have it and not be able to back it up. By the way my test domain is almost up. I didn't want to download my trial of Win7 yet so I used an old WinXP Pro disc that I had around here. It will be my client for now.

RobertKaucher wrote: »

I know it was not directed at me, but I have to say I think it's a joke. I imagine it is enough for the typical admin/MS engineer and I don't think the MCSE:Sec was ever really valued, so MS ditched it. Since they are focusing on job roles I believe MS just didn't think it held value for them. That's what CISSP et al are for, I guess. All just my opinion.

Wow. That is really interesting that you would say that. So you don't think that there will be an MCITP:Enterprise Security Admin or something. I find it hard to believe that they would leave the security concentration behind totally. I mean there are security certs but still...

There is going to be a ISA 2010 (forefront I believe) MCTS but I wonder if that is going to be it...

pml1

I hope to finish up my MCSA:Security in the next few months. *Apparently* adding the :Security will qualify me for a larger raise at my current job.

The prevailing opinion at my currently employer is that I should finish up a MCSE:Security and then upgrade to MCITP:EA...even though we are in the process of upgrading our 2003 servers to 2008 already. I just don't see any reason to finish the MCSE if I'll be working primarily with 2008 servers, and my goal is to reach MCITP:EA.

petedude

knwminus wrote: »

I plan to go MCSA:S > MCITP:EA (not sure when I will pick this up, if ever).
. . .Having a basic understanding of what is out there now will only help me with what is to come (imo). I could be wrong but that is just how I feel. . . ..

Agreed-- that's why I think the MCSA would be of value to you. I'm finding a trend, though, of increasing number of businesses either moving to 2008 or planning to. That's why I think spending the extra time/money to go for the MCSE may not be as valuable as simply going for an MCITP, even if it's just an MCITP:SA.

Bl8ckr0uter

petedude wrote: »

Agreed-- that's why I think the MCSA would be of value to you. I'm finding a trend, though, of increasing number of businesses either moving to 2008 or planning to. That's why I think spending the extra time/money to go for the MCSE may not be as valuable as simply going for an MCITP, even if it's just an MCITP:SA.

Got ya. I thought you were saying that going for the MCSA would be a waste of time completely. Guess I misread you post.

Looking back at what you said, I totally misread it lol.

RobertKaucher

veritas_libertas wrote: »

I think that is completely legitimate answer Robert. I was thinking about purchasing a 298 book to just read. Now I think that might be a waste of money. I will stick with reading up on Server 2008 since I will be working on the MCITP:EA as soon I can.

I do believe the knowledge is good to have. I am not certain of the value of having having the specialization, though. No one has ever commented on my MCSE: Security. I get a few contacts from head hunters every few weeks for the Air Force base just north of me due to my Sec+, but I have never seen a posting for MCSE: Sec in my area. I am very glad I took the cert, though. The knowledge I got from it has helped me in a few situations.

Now for knwminus, I see the value. If you are looking for a security career then I think it's good. If you are a regular admin and if you have the time and money then, sure, get the cert. Just don't think HR will be impressed...

veritas_libertas

RobertKaucher wrote: »

I do believe the knowledge is good to have. I am not certain of the value of having having the specialization, though. No one has ever commented on my MCSE: Security. I get a few contacts from head hunters every few weeks for the Air Force base just north of me due to my Sec+, but I have never seen a posting for MCSE: Sec in my area. I am very glad I took the cert, though. The knowledge I got from it has helped me in a few situations.

Now for knwminus, I see the value. If you are looking for a security career then I think it's good. If you are a regular admin and if you have the time and money then, sure, get the cert. Just don't think HR will be impressed...

I am headed for security, but I am not (unless I get the urge) going to turn around and the MCSE as well as the MCITP:EA.

Bl8ckr0uter

veritas_libertas wrote: »

I am headed for security, but I am not (unless I get the urge) going to turn around and the MCSE as well as the MCITP:EA.

This guy is going to be my rival but I think his RF knowledge and experience gives him an advantage ...lol



At any rate I finished the first set of labs. They were a joke (very easy). Moving on to the second set of chapters and labs tomorrow. Hope to finish both books by Saturday.

veritas_libertas

knwminus wrote: »

This guy is going to be my rival but I think his RF knowledge and experience gives him an advantage ...lol

Hmmmmmmm, and I was thinking the same thing about you

Seriously, your Cisco knowledge is easily superiour to mine!

dynamik

veritas_libertas wrote: »

What do you think about the security concepts in the MCITP:EA? I know that there really isn't a 298 like certification test for the MCITP paths.

It covers the highlights, but I think it lacks depth.

phoeneous

RobertKaucher wrote: »

Consider this: 270/290 are nearly the same test, 291/293 are nearly the same test 299/298 are nearly the same test.

Good to know, thx!

RobertKaucher

phoeneous wrote: »

Good to know, thx!

Keep in mind I was speaking very broadly about objectives, not actual content/questions.

I have a very good ability to see relationships between things and this affects the way I learn. Other people are different and tend to see the differences between things more clearly. Both have their good and bad points. I saw the 293 as much easier than the 291 because to me none of the material was really that new. Other folks have said the 293 is harder than the 291 and I believe these are the people who have a tendency to focus on what is different between the two exams.

phoeneous

RobertKaucher wrote: »

Keep in mind I was speaking very broadly about objectives, not actual content/questions.

I know, thats how I took it. Passed 270 this morning, very excited to move on to the 290 stuff.

category_five

phoeneous wrote: »

I know, thats how I took it. Passed 270 this morning, very excited to move on to the 290 stuff.

Congratulations!

RobertKaucher

phoeneous wrote: »

I know, thats how I took it. Passed 270 this morning, very excited to move on to the 290 stuff.

Good work! Two weeks tops is what I would suggest.

You've got the experience!

rob7278

Great thread! I have been debating the same concerns- should I pursue MCSA/MCSE on 2003 or just go for MCTS/MCITP on 2008? should I go for the security designation?
Through talking to different people this is the path the I have decided to pursue-
70-270 MCP (done), Security+ (done), 70-290 (testing Monday morning)
70-291 MCSA, 70-299 MCSA:Security
70-293, 70-294, 70-298 MCSE:Security
Then I will do the upgrades to MCITP, which shouldn't be too hard because Win Serv 2003 isn't THAT different than 2008 (so i'm told anyway); even if there are huge differences it's not like Windows Server 2003 is going to be disappearing from most businesses any time soon, so MCSA/MCSE isn't really obsolete. The Security specialization may not impress HR people too much, but it's only 1 extra test(70-299) and learning more about security is probably never a bad thing. Besides the security knowledge lets you shave 1 year off the 5 yrs experience requirement on the CISSP, which is a certification that probably will impress HR people.