Do you hang your certs at work?

apena7

Warsh1p wrote: »

I don't think you are understanding the term Engineer. Just because your role is called Network Engineer does not mean you are actually engineering technology. Most companies are to vague with the position titles. Unless you work for Juniper, Cisco or any other networking company that creates the technology you go out and get certifications for, you do not engineer anything.

I feel the same way. I've always thought that unless I'm designing the next routing protocol or latest router from the ground up I wouldn't call myself a network engineer.

networker050184

I work as an engineer (guess that depends on your definition) for a service provider. We aren't doing break/fix work, we are implementing and testing new technologies from the ground up. Research, testing, implementation, support the whole nine yards. While we don't invent new routing protocols or anything like that, its not your basic operators job.

The guy that I was referring to has a masters from a very well respected state school. No knock on the guy, but he just doesn't have the relevant experience to be successful at the next level even though he has the paper.

I'm glad you have people from "forums all over the internet" that agree with you, but thats just not what I've seen in the real world. Until I do, I'll have to disagree with you.

chrisone

this post has turned into a degrees/certs vs experience post. It was a simple do you hang your certs question.


Fact of life, you will fail every time to prove that any validation of education regardless if its a cert or degree is worthless.

Warsh1p

networker050184 wrote: »

I'm glad you have people from "forums all over the internet" that agree with you, but thats just not what I've seen in the real world. Until I do, I'll have to disagree with you.

You are saying that you do not see people aspiring to Create or Develop new technology? I am not understanding this. I never said they agreed with me, I simply stated that many people want to Create or Develop not support throughout their careers...

networker050184

Warsh1p wrote: »

You are saying that you do not see people aspiring to Create or Develop new technology? I am not understanding this. I never said they agreed with me, I simply stated that many people want to Create or Develop not support throughout their careers...

Pretty much. I've never met one person in my career that aspired to create a new routing protocol. I'm sure they are out there, but they are the ones going for masters in electrical engineering or mathematics and not working Cisco support roles Thats kind of my whole point in this. Different qualifications for different job roles.

Warsh1p

networker050184 wrote: »

Pretty much. I've never met one person in my career that aspired to create a new routing protocol. I'm sure they are out there, but they are the ones going for masters in electrical engineering or mathematics and not working Cisco support roles Thats kind of my whole point in this. Different qualifications for different job roles.

So you are agreeing with me? :

I stated:

I will prove this by promising you that any job you ever apply for in your life time you won't be going up against Mr. C.

He is not going for a Cisco support role. But in the astronomically rare chance that he applied for the same support role you are. He will probably get it.

networker050184

Lol ,so are you saying a master is going to help you in this field or not? I guess it comes down to your definition of engineer. IMO, and my employers, I'm an engineer and masters doesn't really help in my field of work.

I never said someone with a masters wouldn't beat me out in a job to develop a new protocol, I said a masters wouldn't help in what I (and the vast majority of people on this forum) do for a living.

phoeneous

Warsh1p wrote: »

You also must have skipped over this..

No, you must've skipped over this..

Unless you work for Juniper, Cisco or any other networking company that creates the technology you go out and get certifications for, you do not engineer anything.

How long have you been in this field? It shows.

I'm going to go engineer a pb&j sandwich now.

snadam

chrisone wrote: »

this post has turned into a degrees/certs vs experience post. It was a simple do you hang your certs question.


Fact of life, you will fail every time to prove that any validation of education regardless if its a cert or degree is worthless.

Let me try and get it back on track then...

To each their own. MOST instances (not all) I see people throw their certs on their cube or signature more as an insecurity than anything else. With the exception of my previous post, there is only one person in the office that seriously puts his certs in his email sig, and he is easily the most insecure person here (for whatever reason). On the other hand, you get your High level certs or degrees, then go right ahead and show them off.

As for me, I just hang them up in my office at home. I play the 'humble card' at work and not try to draw that kind of attention. I think its fine to hang them up in the privacy of your own home. I use it as a motivator to fill up the wall. Hell, its better than looking at the sailboat wallpaper that I'm too lazy to take down in there!!!

Warsh1p

phoeneous wrote: »

No, you must've skipped over this..

How long have you been in this field? It shows.

I'm going to go engineer a pb&j sandwich now.

Your pb&j example still shows how you are misunderstanding my entire point

You are not creating the bread, peanut butter or jelly that is used to make your sandwich. Someone else created or developed the bread, peanut butter or jelly. You are simply putting puzzle pieces together, which is the gist of supporting.

Networking companies such as those I have pointed out create the bread, peanut butter and jelly. In order to work for those companies you normally need a bachelors degree or even masters degree. No it is not necessary but it will help your chances. In my Mr. A, B and C example. Mr. C will get the job at say, Cisco, before Mr. A and B.

My grudge, I suppose, are the people in this thread who say "Ohh I got my diploma but just filed it away". I can't imagine feeling that way towards something that takes some much time and afford. The only conclusions I can come up with of why someone would say that about their degree are, one, they are not proud of it because it comes from a certain school, two it's a degree that no longer pertain to their career or three they are too cool and think it isn't much of an accomplishment as they just conquer anything they want too.

Creator, Developer or Engineer are titles I give someone who invented or built something, say, a simple Cisco Router.
Technician, Operator or Administrator are titles I give someone who places parts together, configures or supports, say, a simple Cisco Router.

Does that all make sense for my argument? Remember most of this is my opinion, like what the Titles mean. Perhaps the dictionary agrees with me, perhaps it doesn't. Perhaps you disagree with me, perhaps someone else doesn't.

Keep 'ing and maybe you will build the next IBM Watson

Warsh1p

snadam wrote: »

As for me, I just hang them up in my office at home. I play the 'humble card' at work and not try to draw that kind of attention. I think its fine to hang them up in the privacy of your own home. I use it as a motivator to fill up the wall. Hell, its better than looking at the sailboat wallpaper that I'm too lazy to take down in there!!!

I do the same. I think home office is a great place to hang up certifications.

colemic

The way I read your definition, you wouldn't consider NASA employees that saved Apollo 13 with a sock, carboard box and plastic bag engineers, because they did not 'engineer' or create the pieces.

They are engineers in my book, and really good ones at that.

Apologies if I misunderstood you, that is just how I interpreted your definition.

Warsh1p wrote: »

Your pb&j example still shows how you are misunderstanding my entire point

You are not creating the bread, peanut butter or jelly that is used to make your sandwich. Someone else created or developed the bread, peanut butter or jelly. You are simply putting puzzle pieces together, which is the gist of supporting.

Networking companies such as those I have pointed out create the bread, peanut butter and jelly. In order to work for those companies you normally need a bachelors degree or even masters degree. No it is not necessary but it will help your chances. In my Mr. A, B and C example. Mr. C will get the job at say, Cisco, before Mr. A and B.

My grudge, I suppose, are the people in this thread who say "Ohh I got my diploma but just filed it away". I can't imagine feeling that way towards something that takes some much time and afford. The only conclusions I can come up with of why someone would say that about their degree are, one, they are not proud of it because it comes from a certain school, two it's a degree that no longer pertain to their career or three they are too cool and think it isn't much of an accomplishment as they just conquer anything they want too.

Creator, Developer or Engineer are titles I give someone who invented or built something, say, a simple Cisco Router.
Technician, Operator or Administrator are titles I give someone who places parts together, configures or supports, say, a simple Cisco Router.

Does that all make sense for my argument? Remember most of this is my opinion, like what the Titles mean. Perhaps the dictionary agrees with me, perhaps it doesn't. Perhaps you disagree with me, perhaps someone else doesn't.

Keep 'ing and maybe you will build the next IBM Watson

Warsh1p

colemic wrote: »

The way I read your definition, you wouldn't consider NASA employees that saved Apollo 13 with a sock, carboard box and plastic bag engineers, because they did not 'engineer' or create the pieces.

They are engineers in my book, and really good ones at that.

Apologies if I misunderstood you, that is just how I interpreted your definition.

I am not talking about materials.

Devilsbane

snadam wrote: »

Let me try and get it back on track then...

To each their own. MOST instances (not all) I see people throw their certs on their cube or signature more as an insecurity than anything else. With the exception of my previous post, there is only one person in the office that seriously puts his certs in his email sig, and he is easily the most insecure person here (for whatever reason). On the other hand, you get your High level certs or degrees, then go right ahead and show them off.

As for me, I just hang them up in my office at home. I play the 'humble card' at work and not try to draw that kind of attention. I think its fine to hang them up in the privacy of your own home. I use it as a motivator to fill up the wall. Hell, its better than looking at the sailboat wallpaper that I'm too lazy to take down in there!!!

For some people, an A+ is a major accomplishment. So now they aren't allowed to post it on the wall because it isn't high enough? If you earned it, feel free to post it wherever you would like to. (If it ends up on the mailbox then there might be an issue...) I have mine framed on a shelf in my bedroom next to my other certifications. It has nothing to do with an insecurity, I am proud of what I have accomplished. Is a medical doctor insecure because s/he has a nameplate that says PhD outside their office? They have worked hard to earn that distinction and should display it proudly.

At some point I also intend to put my certifications in my signature of my emails. Why not? I like seeing them on other peoples emails so that I can get a feel for what they know. It is a great conversation starter and a way to network with people. I have met several people at my company that way. I see that they have a cert that I am working on and then we talk about it for a little bit, and then I walk away with a few pointers and a new friend.