who does/doesn't have a job?

Mike-Mike

Bl8ckr0uter wrote: »

You know what is a really under used resource for finding jobs? The local classifieds. I have had several leads from local classifieds and a part time job from those leads. Word of mouth and local advertisements are still extremely important in this highly technical, impersonal job search of today.

you know I had that idea, and I have been looking the past few weeks in the Sunday paper and I haven't seen much at all, i think (in my area at least) they are mostly online.

erpadmin

Bl8ckr0uter wrote: »

I don't think that her statement is completely true but I think it is more true now and than it was 10 years ago. It will be more true 10 years from now than it is today.

If you think for a second that IT jobs are going to go to strictly to ITT graduates, college graduates, or even those with an A.S degree, you are grossly mistaken (with all due respect). I recently saw an IT job that required a HS diploma and some experience at a very big Division 1 school while doing a casual search for a friend of mine. Now for "some experience", that is extremely relative and does require creativity (and being creative is not outright lying...I mean being creative with an entry level resume).

Plus, there is always someone, somewhere who will simply be a "right-place-at-the-right-time" person.

I'll say this though...right now, employers are going to be extremely picky. This happens EVERYTIME there is a down economy. And it always seems like unemployment will stay above 10%. It won't. These type of things happen in cycles. ("It's the economy...") The only thing I have seen today is that IT folks are getting highly scrutinized AND the promise of seeing $100k after getting an MCSE is pretty much gone to the wayside, as opposed to 10-15 years ago. That, and also pre-dot.com bust, IT running the business process as opposed to the other way around. But the process of getting in the IT field will pretty much be the same as it always as been....aptitude, knowing the right person, and being at the right place at the right time. That stuff will never change, IMHO.

Bl8ckr0uter

erpadmin wrote: »

If you think for a second that IT jobs are going to go to strictly to ITT graduates, college graduates, or even those with an A.S degree, you are grossly mistaken (with all due respect). I recently saw an IT job that required a HS diploma and some experience at a very big Division 1 school while doing a casual search for a friend of mine. Now for "some experience", that is extremely relative and does require creativity (and being creative is not outright lying...I mean being creative with an entry level resume).

That's why I didn't say she was 100% correct. If you think that certs don't matter for someone who is entry level (who doesn't have another "in") then I think you are grossly mistaken (with all due respect and not trying to start a flame war either )

I know there is more than just that but these little pieces of paper do matter to HR.

erpadmin wrote: »

I'll say this though...right now, employers are going to be extremely picky. This happens EVERYTIME there is a down economy. And it always seems like unemployment will stay above 10%. It won't. These type of things happen in cycles. ("It's the economy...") The only thing I have seen today is that IT folks are getting highly scrutinized AND the promise of seeing $100k after getting an MCSE is pretty much gone to the wayside, as opposed to 10-15 years ago. That, and IT running the business process as opposed to the other way around. But the process of getting in the IT field will pretty much be the same as it always as been....aptitude, knowing the right person, and being at the right place at the right time. That stuff will never change, IMHO.

This is 1000% true.

NetworkingStudent

Mike-Mike wrote: »

I see a lot of certs on this board, but I never know who does what, except for a few I can remember...

who has a job? who has a stack of certs and still can't find work?


I only have 1 cert right now, I plan on looking for a job again in Dec/Jan, but then I plan on having ITIL, A+, Net+, Security+, and 1 more which I have yet to decide upon... I already have an Associates in Business and 9 years of experience with AT&T, half in a call center and half as a service tech.

just trying to get a rough idea of what the job scene i like...

I have a non IT job….Currently I work at a local printer, and I’m going to be done with school in December of this year and I will have A.A.S degree in Information Technology. When fall quarter starts in October I will start actively looking for work, because the job market sucks right now. I think I might need a few months of searching to find a good role. I know a lot of my peers in my classes don’t have jobs at all. I met one guy that had been doing desktop support andfixing printers for over 20 years!! He said he was making close to 20-30 an hour. He can’t find work, because he was laid off, and then he did some contract work. He said I’m lucky that I have a job… I think it’s rough everywhere. I like the I passed cert threads, because it motivates me to study harder. This is the only place I can go to and talk to people about certs, because 90-95% of my peers at work and school don’t study for them. Nor, do they understand the point of getting them.
I think it’s almost necessary to have a job to get certified, just because the study materials, vouchers, and practice tests can be very expensive.

erpadmin

Bl8ckr0uter wrote: »

That's why I didn't say she was 100% correct. If you think that certs don't matter for someone who is entry level (who doesn't have another "in") then I think you are grossly mistaken (with all due respect and not trying to start a flame war either )

I know there is more than just that but these little pieces of paper do matter to HR.

Thankfully, there are other avenues to a IT job than the HR recruiting drones, which is why I can safely say that certs won't matter, and have no doubt we can remain gentlemen and friends. Of course, there is always the YMMV caveat. (BTW, flaming is for children...if it got to that, I'll just man up and walk away. Being an Internet tough guy is kinda lame and some other word I use for lame [if I was going to say what it was, I would have...and I'm not. ]).

Out of the 4 IT jobs I ever had, only one was ever with a HR recruiter. This was in late 2000, and I needed at the time A+ and Network+. For my interview, I was asked if I had A+. I said no, and was given a motherboard and asked what this was and what that was. Suffice it to say I got the job. I was supposed to have gotten A+/Network+ before 6 months was up, but after I was closing tickets in an efficient manner, it was irrelevant. (And that was my second IT job.....first job with no "in" too. )

Certs have their place, no question about it. Otherwise, why are we here? But will I ever say you need a cert to get a job in IT? NEVER! Certs, IMO should quantify or rather help to quantify hands on experience. I will never say certs can be in lieu of that experience.

msteinhilber

I have a job, presently jack of all trades by function and "LAN Technician" by official title. I hope to not have it soon, I'm fast approaching the 4 year mark in March 2011 and really have no desire to reach that point. I get to play with plenty of equipment and technology, but there is a particular individual who doesn't pull their own weight by any stretch in our small 3 many department. And on top of that our small 3 man department is the same small 3 man department there was before over 25 offices and countless users were added... and they keep buying/merging with more new offices.

So the last quarter of 2010 and 1st quarter of 2011 is find a new job time for me.

EDIT: Oh, I had this job before I had any certs or degree. Just about 8 years experience in a management role for a local PC repair and sales shop where I casually did small business work somewhat getting exposure to IT doing such.

za3bour

I think there is nothing worse than going go an Interview with an MCSE for example and being asked a silly DNS question and not be able to a answer it.

What would that say about you ? on the other hand if you could answer a complicated DNS problem without having Certs that as well would say a lot about you.

rob7278

Recently accepted IT position. From my experience, forums like this are great for setting realistic expectations about how certifications may or may not help you get a job or advance to a better position.
Basically what I have learned from the advice of the more experienced people here is- there is no magic formula for getting the perfect IT job.
I thought once I earned the MCSA I would have no problem getting a Tech Support job; however I didn't receive hardly any more calls on my resume after I added MCSA. It wasn't until I revised my resume for the 6th or 7th time that I finally started getting good activity- and on my last revision I had moved my certs to the 2nd page (last section of my resume) and moved my experience to the 2nd section right after my personal profile.

Mike-Mike

NetworkingStudent wrote: »

I have a non IT job….Currently I work at a local printer, and I’m going to be done with school in December of this year and I will have A.A.S degree in Information Technology. When fall quarter starts in October I will start actively looking for work, because the job market sucks right now. I think I might need a few months of searching to find a good role.

if you are looking for jobs in October, but you don't graduate in December, what happens if you find a job sooner as opposed to later? Do you plan on asking them to hold it until you are done with school? Or do you have online or night classes that you could rearrange to fit a work schedule?

I ask because I am in that same boat, I have day classes and I plan on going back to work in Dec/Jan, and I do search the job boards, but I wouldnt' think that it would work out for me if I found the perfect job tomorrow

erpadmin

za3bour wrote: »

What would that say about you ? on the other hand if you could answer a complicated DNS problem without having Certs that as well would say a lot about you.

Between the expense and time for earning certs and trying to start a young family, for example, it was felt that it was better to understand what it was that was being supported (in other words learning to do my current job better) and then earn my cert later.

Believe me, when said a long those lines, you find a lot of understanding hiring managers and if everything else fits, the experience sells itself!

Having said that though, certs can always be learned later (and they are in my case!).

Paul Boz

You don’t need a degree to get higher paying IT jobs either. You have a significantly greater chance of doing so, but there’s usually a tradeoff. I’ve got 3 years of college experience which is much better to put on the resume than leaving college off entirely. Just like there are certain certs that will negate the need for a degree, there’s a certain amount of experience you can have to do the same. My current employer waived a pretty significant degree requirement for me to work here because I’ve got extensive experience and quality certs. I’d say that out of all of the career fields, IT is probably the easiest to advance in without a degree. Academia has largely ignored IT and IT-related studies for so long that many employers see the degree purely as proof of commitment and understand there’s not usually much professional skill tied to it. The best option would be to get a business or business management degree combined with solid IT certs. This gives you the best path into higher level IT management.

za3bour

erpadmin wrote: »

Having said that though, certs can always be learned later (and they are in my case!).

I couldn't agree more, my last exam was back in 2005 and now 5 years later I decided its about time and because I have a good experience hopefully I will finish MCITP-EA and SA in about 7 months.

That wouldn't be possible without experience especially that i work full time and have a family to support (actually two since i help my parents)

tpatt100

Bl8ckr0uter wrote: »

I don't think that her statement is completely true but I think it is more true now and than it was 10 years ago. It will be more true 10 years from now than it is today.

Yeah it was much easier ten years ago. Now I noticed the trend where companies are trying to consolidate IT jobs to get as much bang for the buck as possible.

BlackBella

I just saw a IT entry level job at Ft. Gordon, but applicant must have 24 months of IT experience or 60 IT credits, and mandatory professional A+ certification.

Oh well! I could call somebody and use my family connections, but nah!

In other news, Walmart called me for a job (non-IT related), but it is $43,000 a year:D.

The GS job that would get me in the system to eventually apply for a IT job on base finally listed me as a candidate. Top 10 out of 500 candidates makes me happy. Even if I don't get the job, I still have am happy!!!!

IT department at a future place I like to work at chief said he would assign somebody to mentor me while I start at WGU. Free unpaid hands on training with vets works for me.


I think it was the food I would bring to the department. I can whip up some mean German, Korean, Panamanian, and Caribbean food.

NinjaBoy

I'm an IT manager (been for almost 5 years). You can see my community profile for my quals

-Ken