HELP - I feel like my CIS/MIS degree is worthless
slangtang
Registered Users Posts: 4 ■□□□□□□□□□
Hello,
A little background, I need help deciding on what to do or how to go about doing it. last summer i graduated with a bachelor's degree with a BBA in MIS (BIg name University in Texas) . I got into this program becuse i am interested in technology,comps and since the degree is from their business school i felt that the exposure to business classes would be a great help. Unfortunately for me the kind of "TECH jobs" i have ever had was being a TECH support (Phone support call center type) for a large TELCO company, which i was laid off a couple months ago due to "restructuring of departments".
So here is my dilema and also where i seem to be struggling a lot. The jobs i feel i would be qualified for or would excel in would be maybe support like a system admin or the like. Unfortunately for the few interviews i have been able to go they all say, you are "too green" in IT or you need more experience so am like WTF how am i supposed to gain experience, if i do not gain the exposure. I thought with my education i could atleast get my foot through the door and then learn as i go (Fast learner). This is becoming frustrating and if i apply for the other helpdesk type of jobs they are coming back as
1. Pay is too low ( have to pay student loans)
2. i do not really want to be in phone support
3. You are not qualified because you have no experience in a Corporate IT type enviroment, since my background is callcenter.
and even if i apply for desktop support type jobs i am not getting any responses or if i do the responses are like above.... Also whats the deal with recruiters WOW..
So fellow Board members what am i doing wrong?
how do i leverage my degree to get a job?
what other areas can i explore in order to be more marketable?
how would my IT CIS degree get me in other positions since all require some kind of experience?
Thanks for reading my post and any other advice,heads up, questions are welcome..
A little background, I need help deciding on what to do or how to go about doing it. last summer i graduated with a bachelor's degree with a BBA in MIS (BIg name University in Texas) . I got into this program becuse i am interested in technology,comps and since the degree is from their business school i felt that the exposure to business classes would be a great help. Unfortunately for me the kind of "TECH jobs" i have ever had was being a TECH support (Phone support call center type) for a large TELCO company, which i was laid off a couple months ago due to "restructuring of departments".
So here is my dilema and also where i seem to be struggling a lot. The jobs i feel i would be qualified for or would excel in would be maybe support like a system admin or the like. Unfortunately for the few interviews i have been able to go they all say, you are "too green" in IT or you need more experience so am like WTF how am i supposed to gain experience, if i do not gain the exposure. I thought with my education i could atleast get my foot through the door and then learn as i go (Fast learner). This is becoming frustrating and if i apply for the other helpdesk type of jobs they are coming back as
1. Pay is too low ( have to pay student loans)
2. i do not really want to be in phone support
3. You are not qualified because you have no experience in a Corporate IT type enviroment, since my background is callcenter.
and even if i apply for desktop support type jobs i am not getting any responses or if i do the responses are like above.... Also whats the deal with recruiters WOW..
So fellow Board members what am i doing wrong?
how do i leverage my degree to get a job?
what other areas can i explore in order to be more marketable?
how would my IT CIS degree get me in other positions since all require some kind of experience?
Thanks for reading my post and any other advice,heads up, questions are welcome..
Comments
Are you currently working? If not, too little pay is better than no pay.
You're going to have to suck it up. If you look over the boards, it's been said over and over. You have to start somewhere. We've all done the crap IT jobs to gain experience. It sounds like you've had a couple opportunities but didn't take them.
BS, Information Technology
So, the gist of my advice: keep searching for places to hire you so you can get experience, start working on certs, and go where the work is.
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Second, your going to have to suck it up and take a crap job first and get experience. Coming right out of college doesn't mean you know how to manage a infrastructure, servers, networks and the like. I sure wouldn't let a fresh grad manage my servers.
Now if your not getting the great paying jobs then you may have to volunteer first to get some initial experience. Also check with your local Bestbuy stores for geek squad jobs. That will atleast give you experience with desktop troubleshooting if you land one of those.
Good luck with you search.
The guys said it. In IT experience is king. There's a very slim chance you can land the job you are looking for right now based solely on your degree. I agree that you will need to start at Help Desk. Instead of a call center type of job you may want to look into a desktop gig or something more hands on.
Also, don't forget that the market is just picking up and there's still a lot of qualified talent (with education and experience) out there without a job.
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All this is very true::::
In addition to what has been said, a degree is never a waste! Long term they will only help you. Who knows, maybe in ten years you might find yourself managing one of us...
IT is a strange animal and it infuriates me that Professors/Instructors tell their students that an IT degree equals an instant well paying job. That is simply a lie, and it's not unusual for an IT graduate fresh out of college to make ten or fifteen dollars an hour starting out.
Well I'm on this rant, does anyone think the numerous different flavors of IT degrees confuses employers?
*CIS (Computer Information Systems)
*MIS (Management Information Systems)
*IT (Information Technology)
*CS (Computer Science)
*Informatics
*BS wi/emphasis in IT
*AAS degrees with numerous different names.
There are not many companies that will trust their servers in to the hands of someone who has no real world experience doing so. You get experience by spending a few years in the help desk and hopefully getting some projects where you get some server side experience. You then might be able to land a junior admin position.
You can't expect to make lots of money without having the experience to back it up. A college degree will make you shine verses the many candidates who do not have one, but it does not mean you will instantly start making lots of money.
When you do not have experience, you do not have much to bargain with. Take what you can get and learn everything you can. Before I became a Systems Admin I spent a few years on the phone doing tech support for a large ISP, that was some of the best experience I ever gained.
I agree with the numerous IT degree confusion. Example - My community college offers an A.S in CIS with an emphasis as PC Support Specialist and another in Electronics with an emphasis as a Computer technician. I recently switched from CIS to Electronics.
Your degree is far from worthless. That is something you will come to appreciate later on in life when you realise that education is much more than simply turning up at school to obtain a bit of paper to tick an HR box. You were 'educated', and that is something that will help you once you have some 'experience'.
The problem you have is legion for graduates in your position. You have failed to be picked up by a big company that cherry picks the best graduates and puts them in a fast track graduate program. Those people don't do help desk. They get exposure to projects and senior management very soon, they shadow experienced people and work as a lieutenant on important infrastructure refresh projects and before long they are tossed projects they will lead themselves.
So your only option is to be one of the great unwashed (I was that soldier) and take a grunt job in IT and work your way up. You will find plenty of advice and support here as TE is a predomantly bluecollar forum.
When it comes to breaking into the IT experience is king. Your degree will be very valuable down the road once you've established yourself in the IT community, but until then you’re going to have to face the fact that you might have work some low paying grunt work. Even realizing you have student loans, like one poster mentioned, some pay is better than no pay. You may have to defer those loans a couple of months.
Don’t despair though. You might be initially working a call center with guys with no degree and a handful of Comptia certs, but coupled with hard, diligent work, your degree will help elevate you past your peers when higher positions open.
Courses Required For Me To Graduate WGU in MS: IT Network Managment: MCT2, LZT2, MBT1, MDT2, MNT2
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and then do some research of who they subcontract with and apply to those companies. Another thing would go ahead and apply for some GS positions within the government.
This is where colleges are missing it big time IMHO. Even in this day and age, they arent doing enough to train sys admins...if anything at all. The main focus is on programming and databases - and the rest of your time is spent with all the non-IT track classes. So, when you graduate, you dont have a base in cisco or server 2k3/2k8. There's so much out there they dont teach you about - in college its all theory BS. When you get out there and start working with group policies, AD, backup/recovery, virtualization, etc...thats where you learn your job.
Unfortunately, this is where you have to accept that you either have to have a friend to get hired on somewhere, or you start doing certs for the jobskills you want to have...and they're not cheap. Cheaper compared to your college, but still a time and money hog.
I just turned my BS:IT transcripts in to my HR department a few days ago. I checked today and it shows my degree as MIS.
I called our support line and spoke with an HR rep who said "Oh, all IT degrees are the same. We just randomly pick one when we put it in the system." I was actually so shocked at that answer I said "umm...ok" and hung up. I'm still debating on whether or not its a battle worth fighting.
Depends on what you want to go into. Chances are you will start out on the help desk or desk-side support in some fashion. If that is the case A+ and Network+ will put you into a pretty good spot to be picked up for that type of job. Now I did see you mention that you wanted to do server type work, after your initial certs you can branch into the MS side of things.
Also after you've done your couple of years on a desk, look to try and move up into a role that'll expose you to more things. If that isn't available at the present company start to look elsewhere. A lot of folks on here have touted the much desired "small shop" as a means of getting exposure to a ton of information very quickly. I'm headed into this role myself after spending 3 years doing network help desk so it is possible to get there.
You just have to apply yourself and always try and grow more. I've seen folks who have spent 10+ years on help desk because that was as far as they were prepared to take it. Nothing wrong with that, just not my particular cup of tea and it doesn't sound to be yours either. Once you're in that initial role you can always come back here for advice or support, great community with a ton of folks at all ranges of their career.
WGU MS:ISA Completed October 30th 2013.
Priceless. I guess that depends on which would be more respected
Once you pick one of those, you'll have a better understanding of what to do. In either case, unless a job specifically wants you to have it, IMHO the comptia certs arent worth the time and effort. If you pick networking - start with CCENT/ICND1. If you pick Server admin, go with the Server 2k8 AD/GPMC material. If you specifically go after a helpdesk spot, look into the Windows 7 exam(s).
I'll probably get some heat here for steering you away from A+/N+, but I dont see the ROI anymore. A+ will cost you $340 just for the 2 tests - not including books, and expire in the same timeframe.
Be prepared to lab something up, so you wont just be studying a book, you should plan to do what you study. Try the MS virtual HD's:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/bb738372
If you do cisco, spend a few hundred dollars on some gear to work with.
Good luck.
My company is the same and for the most part I think all the contracting companies in my office have a similar attitude. My company just considers it another hash mark to check off in a folder; they're much more concerned about certifications and DOD 8570 compliance.
Do your best to gain experience.
Your degree is not wasted it is far superior to any certification. (In my opinion)
Unless you have a close personal familiy member or friend who you can leverage to get you in the door, you are going to have to put your time in just like most of us.
This is a good start. I was in the same position you're in about a year ago and this is what I did, and I got very lucky. Look for positions where you think they might be trying to 'groom' someone. If you're ok with that and can find it, you're set.
Straight talk is necessary on these forums. Certifications are a fact of life in IT, A+ or Microsoft desktop certs, it almost doesn't matter, are a must to get entry level jobs. You have to do at least one of them. Microsoft or Cisco, in this world you have to do both. There are very few Cisco only jobs out there and Microsoft admins that aren't able to TEACH CCNA networking are practically useless. Unless you have a degree in straight computer science from a brick and mortar school, you won't be hired on out of college as a programmer.
This is a great field to work in with really good earning potential. It is rapidly getting very white collar with a lot of emphasis on project management, customer service, and technical skills all wrapped up in one person. There are very few fields that you can get that level of responsibility and pay without a bachelor's degree or in some cases a master's degree. Don't get discouraged because its hard to find a job right now, its hard for everyone.
I think it depends on the degree and the program. My computer science program was alot of programming. However, the process of programming teachers you logic which is a huge help in IT. I see so many people in IT that are book smart, but have difficulty troubleshooting issues they have had no prior exposure to. A good computer science program should teach that. In addition, in my program at least, we learned about all facets of computers. All they way down to assembly language. I know while in the program i had no interest in programming as a career. However, at least in my experience, the program was beneficial to my overall computer knowledge. However, the program itself will not give you experience. I also had toe foresight to get IT experience while in school so that when i graduated i wouldn't just have a degree.
To the OP, Your degree will help you. Trust me its not a waste. But as many others have said, in IT, you will need to get your foot in the door. Even if its a low paying job, sometimes you have to do that to get to where you want to go.
Good luck!
It really depends on what you are measuring. A mission critical service provider will take a timeserved CCIE in operations with no degree to be technical lead over a degreed
CCNA or even CCNP In some situations there does come a point when classical education is less important that practical and technical qualifications and proven ability.
Generally though we do see degrees being a requirement for entry level and higher roles in the larger companies.