Lost and pissed off

Deus Ex Machina

Hi guys,

I doubt many of you guys remember one of my last posts from a while ago, but I'm a 21 yr old graduating from a no-name university, and I am in a kinda cruddy situation where I have good credentials from an education perspective, but no connections and facing a terrible job climate in my state (Connecticut). I have a hard time finding work even within the state (where people at least know what my university is), and applying for stuff outside the state has been relatively fruitless.

A lot of people have told me to go for a masters degree at a top school to fix that issue, but a lot more people tell me to get a job first that will help pay for that degree so that I am not taking a $100k gamble. I spoke with a friend recently who graduated from a pretty nice MBA program, but has been struggling to find work. Even she recommended I get work experience first.

Unfortunately, that creates a chicken before the egg situation as the point of the degree was to get a job, but the point of a job would be to get the degree. It feels like I'm trapped.

I hate begging people for job leads, but do any of you guys have recommendations? I'm technically gonna graduate in May, but I will have fulfilled my degree requirements by the end of January so I won't need to stay in this state anymore. Can go anywhere in the country. That would also mean I could start off with an internship in the spring, if that's something that would be preferred.

I'm an MIS major and I have experience in business analysis, project management, and Attack Surface Management aspects of cyber security. I have a little bit of work experience in each of those areas, and I'm willing to delve deeper in any of those areas.

Thanks guys.

kaiju

If you are OK with living in Japan there are (60) $20~$25/hr tax free Win10 deployment jobs open right now. 6month contract that can lead to a permanent position. PM me if interested.

GirlyGirl

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

Hi guys,

I doubt many of you guys remember one of my last posts from a while ago, but I'm a 21 yr old graduating from a no-name university Relative to location, and I am in a kinda cruddy situation where I have good credentials from an education perspective, but no connections and facing a terrible job climate in my state (Connecticut) First rule of thumb, Location is EVERYTHING. That is also the first problem. I have never heard people say IT jobs were "Hot" in Connecticut, never will. No offense. I have a hard time finding work even within the state See above(where people at least know what my university See Above is), and applying for stuff outside the state has been relatively fruitless I never heard anyone in Northern Virginia, Washington DC say that...

A lot of people have told me to go for a masters degree Not a horrible idea.at a top school to fix that issue, but a lot more people tell me to get a job first that will help pay for that degree so that I am not taking a $100k gamble. 100k for graduate school? Where Yale? I am paying, oops I am sorry my job is paying around 34k for me. 15k a year for 2 years. I am sure I'll just pay the 4k out the pocket. I am sure the ghosts of WGU will come and suggest you attend that school. Just wait.....No offense but they are coming. I spoke with a friend Watch out for that word. recently who graduated from a pretty nice MBA program An MBA is like candy corn on Halloween. So, they got an MBA and thinks it's the golden ticket to a job and they are proved wrong? Tell me it ain't so. but has been struggling to fine work No surprises here. Even she recommended I get work experience first. Life Rule 1: NEVER take advice from someone who is struggling, can't find work, and/or in a worst situation than you. You are welcome.

Unfortunately, that creates a chicken before the egg situation as the point of the degree was to get a job, but the point of a job would be to get the degree. It feels like I'm trapped.

I hate begging people for job leads, but do any of you guys have recommendations? I'm technically gonna graduate in May, but I will have fulfilled my degree requirements by the end of January so I won't need to stay in this state anymore. Can go anywhere in the country. That would also mean I could start off with an internship Why take a step backwards? Not all internships leads to jobs. A good portion just use you for whatever project is going on with no intentions of bringing you on. Some are not paid. Some are paid crappy. You plan on living with your parents or a trailer home? In the spring, if that's something that would be preferred.

I'm an MIS major and I have experience in business analysis, project management, and Attack Surface Management aspects What does that mean? of cyber security. I have a little bit of work experience in each of those areas, and I'm willing to delve deeper in any of those areas.

Thanks guys.

See bold then the RED

mzx380

A few things with this post
1) I think you need to elaborate on what it is you're looking to do! What is your end goal? What positions are you applying to to further that goal?
2) Please keep in mind that you are not finished with your education yet and may have to temper your expectations a bit to land that coveted first job.

cshkuru

OK, keep in mind opinions are like assholes - everyone has one, but I don't think your situation is necessarily as dire as you make it out to be.

1. Apply to every government agency that you can. Get on USAjobs and apply to everything you are remotely qualified for. Government is one of the largest IT employers at all levels.

2. Dell, HP, IBM etc all have recent grad programs. Apply to all of them.

3. Get registered with Teksystems, Parker Staffing, Insight Global etc. Contract work isn't great but it builds experience and can lead to an FTE conversion.

4. Start attending local trade group meetings (look on meetup, register with ISACA, that sort of thing)

Don't worry about the Masters yet but keep in mind that a lot of companies like Emerson do have programs to bring on newly graduated MBAs so in a few months you may want to revisit.

Just some suggestions - hopefully one or two will be helpful.

Deus Ex Machina

@ GirlyGirl
Yeah people don't hear much about Connecticut...in general haha. If not for the UConn Huskies people wouldn't even realize its a state that exists...
I get that location is everything. Many people have told me the same thing you just did about the internship being a step backwards. I'm kinda at a loss for what else to do though. I suppose I could get an MS (not MBA) from a pretty nice school that isn't ridiculously expensive, and maybe in a different state where I could benefit from a healthier IT job market.


@Mzx380
My goal in the short term was to get a rotational/entry level position where I could figure out what my actual strengths and weaknesses are (college can give you hints but doesn't really answer that question). I've been applying for a lot of IT rotational programs with the local insurance companies here in CT< as well as few companies outside of Connecticut. The ones outside of CT have been a bit underwhelming.

Long term, my goal was to get my masters paid for by my company so that I could grow beyond my current limitations.

@cshkuru
Thanks for the suggestions.

volfkhat

kaiju wrote: »

If you are OK with living in Japan there are (60) $20~$25/hr tax free Win10 deployment jobs open right now. 6month contract that can lead to a permanent position. PM me if interested.

Hey now, that actually sounds kinda cool;
but i thought your employment has to be a full 12-months in order to be tax free.

Are you sure 6-months is accurate?



As for OP,
yeah, Location kind of matters.
And as already said months earlier; maybe a Masters isn't the elixir that some claim it to be.

Go get a job at a Noc, at an Enterprise, or through a Government subcontract.
Either way... Get the Experience (move if necessary)... Worry about the MAsters later.

EANx

1) Stay away from the Masters for now. It can help later but right now it's just throwing money down the pit. All for what, for companies to consider you over-qualified for entry-level jobs?

2) Consider applying to one of the many US Gov't contractors that do work overseas

3) Move to a location that has a lot of jobs and couch-surf

The nice thing about being young is flexibility. The average 50 year-old couldn't move without a truck and a couple of laborers but at your age? You should be able to put everything of importance in a backpack and suitcase and head off. And if you don't like where you land, there's probably a bus station nearby ready to take you somewhere else.

mactex

BLUF: Leave now while you are young!

As someone who grew up in CT, and it pains me to says this; you must get out of there. It is bankrupt, and all the big companies are pretty much gone. Whoever is left there will be paying for the insanity. If you must stay in New England; head up to Boston. It is a major tech hub, and there are plenty of jobs. NYC also if you need to stay near family. I now live in Texas and we love it. I do miss New England; but my QoL is way better down here.

kaiju

The six month position can lead to a permanent position. They are always looking for Tier 1 and Tier 2 personnel.

Bjcheung77

I would recommend applying everywhere you can. Place your resume online and to head hunters. Do you have your own personal site or blog? Create a page documenting your expertise and when you send your resume out, have that link in there to showcase your skills. I would take any contract position or part time not just full time. You want to show employers you're currently working and not jobless.

Kaiju, what are the requirements for the jobs in Japan? 6-12 months is a good time frame for learning experiences, especially if you get international recognition of your skills, hmm... interesting thing there!

boxerboy1168

kaiju wrote: »

If you are OK with living in Japan there are (60) $20~$25/hr tax free Win10 deployment jobs open right now. 6month contract that can lead to a permanent position. PM me if interested.

that sounds really fun

scaredoftests

move to the DC metro area. Plenty of job here...

boxerboy1168

how long do you think it would take to find a job with a A+ Net+ and CCENT

TechGuru80

Is your university accredited? As long as it is, it won't really matter especially if you have an ok GPA. Are you still going to be taking classes till May? A lot of times internships during the year require you to be enrolled. As far as out of state, most companies...especially for lower level positions...are going to prefer local candidates because they are usually pretty competitive with lots of applicants. Have you thought about trying to get an MCSA to try and widen your exposure? You might be able to almost finish by May and that could pump up your resume. If you could find a local internship that would be good too but I would be careful on relocating until you have the degree...and preferably a job in hand. Additionally, it will look really weird on your resume if you try to relocate and don't have a completed degree...not that it isn't explainable but you might not get to the point where you can explain it, so it would more so look like you are leaving your program at the very end.

You would get nothing out of an MBA at this point, and you couldn't even get into a program without a degree in hand...save that for down the road.

Deus Ex Machina

@mactex
Haha yep, been getting that advice a lot, especially lately. Lots of friends have been going down to Florida, thinking I might join them. I guess I'll go where I get a job offer first and then be picky about state though...

@Kaiju
The Japan job sounds like a lot of fun, something I'll look into for sure.

@scaredoftests
Sure I would move there, but I imagine doing that without a job offer in hand would be a bad idea (pretty expensive). I do have family in that general area though, might be able to live with them while I look for work.


@techguru
My school is AACSB accredited, which I believe means that the credits would be recognized at any other AACSB school (granted, the top ones don't really care about it).

TechGuru80

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

@techguru
My school is AACSB accredited, which I believe means that the credits would be recognized at any other AACSB school (granted, the top ones don't really care about it).

That is a normal accreditation....plenty of known schools so you should be fine. I am not sure what you mean by "the top ones don't really care about it." I was referring more about employers...honestly I have seen all kinds of different degree programs at major companies but the preference is not to have a speculative degree. If you go back I guarantee top schools aren't going to overlook degrees from non-accredited schools. If you are really interested in going back to school in the next 4-5 years, you could also consider taking the GRE / GMAT since you are already in the school mode...the score is good for 5 years...but it won't really help you right now.

scaredoftests

@scaredoftests
Sure I would move there, but I imagine doing that without a job offer in hand would be a bad idea (pretty expensive). I do have family in that general area though, might be able to live with them while I look for work.


[/QUOTE]
Send out your resumes first while you are living it CT. What is the harm in that? LOL

kaiju

@Bjcheung You will need to contact the recruiters but probably A+ and Sec+ at a minimum. PM me and I will send you the recruiters info.

Jobs are on US military bases. Okinawa Japan and Iwakuni Japan.

Qord

If you don't want to stray too far from home just yet, check out the areas around Dartmouth College in N.H. and Waterbury/Montpelier VT. I constantly see open positions for state and private. Plus, it's close enough to easily make it home when you want, but not close enough for family to be there every weekend. That's how I wound up up here, just far enough away...

ITSpectre

Richmond VA is where I live.... plenty of Jobs here and in DC. Mostly Federal in DC.... regular here in richmond. I applied and got a job within a few weeks of moving here. granted its contract work, but something is better then nothing.

ThePawofRizzo

Lots of good advice here. From my view the real "problem" here is that you are just finishing college and don't have a wealth of on the job experience. College and tech school and certs all help toward the end goal, but companies generally want someone they perceive can hit the ground running. Recent college grads, unless they've worked full-time in IT while they pursued their degree. Even if you have some hands-on experience here and there, managers still see you as a fresh, young graduate who may, or may not, be worth trying out - especially if they are getting resumes of people with a few years on-the-job already.

I can't speak for what the market in Connecticut is like, but I deal with a lot of people in Oklahoma and Colorado and there are many IT jobs around the urban areas. There are definitely contract jobs in many cases, but with little experience that may be the route to go.

Many of us face the same issues you are facing now, and one way or the other got past the dilemma and into IT careers. Sometimes it takes time and effort, but if you are persistent, do interviews well, work hard, and are employable (meaning you have some skills, bathe regularly, wear a suit to an interview, etc.) you can achieve what most people in IT have done.

I agree with others that I wouldn't pursue a Master's at the moment. Outside of research, Master's degrees are generally viewed for as management roles, and no experience will just make it overkill on a resume. Better to pursue some more certifications at this point. Then, if you find a company with a nice education reimbursement plan, let them help you pay for it. And you can find many good state schools where a Master's is about $30K+. I wouldn't suggest going for an MBA at that point, unless you just want to be a manager. The market is saturated with them. Better to pursue a Master's in a technical arena if possible.

Cisco Inferno

Machina, do not move to Florida.
Consistantly ranks low in Tech workers' salary, COL, satisfaction, job openings.

Lived in Miami for 4 years and felt that it stagnated my career.

Moved to Denver. You might want to consider it. It was actually ranking #4 compared to #104 Miami in a few rankings when I moved last year.

Salaries are inflated and the cost of living is not that bad. Plenty of job openings with ISP's, Data Centers, and other major players who have a large presence.

xxxkaliboyxxx

Take this with a grain of salt, but I could speak on Huntsville, that place was awesome and I loved it.

Best New Cities for Tech Jobs | Money

edit: I notice a few Florida cities.

tedjames

xxxkaliboyxxx wrote: »

Take this with a grain of salt, but I could speak on Huntsville, that place was awesome and I loved it.

Best New Cities for Tech Jobs | Money

edit: I notice a few Florida cities.

Huntsville, AL, is #1. I lived and worked there at a software company in the early '90s (I'm old). It was a pretty hot place for tech work back then. I had friends at NASA, Boeing, Intergraph, etc., and it seemed like everyone was hiring there. It wasn't a bad place to live for families, but if you were single, it was a bit more difficult. My friends and I would often have to drive to Nashville, Birmingham, or even Atlanta to see any good touring bands. I hear it's gotten better there since then.

TechGuru80

It's always entertaining when older/married people say certain places are great places to live...except for the fact those places are usually lacking in a lot of social activities. Honestly if you are moving far from where you live and don't know people in a location, I would stick to at least around 1 million or more population because of job options and social life. Small places like Huntsville tend to be reliant on a single industry (usually government)...which could be a positive or negative depending on how you look at it...of course its negative though if budget cuts happen.

On a side note, you could never pay me enough to go to Alabama.

kaiju

Social life is irrelevant when rent and bills consume so much of the paycheck that there is almost nothing left to save and just enough to not be on a ramen noodle diet. Partying at the soup kitchen doesn't sound like fun to me. Take advantage of the ability to move around with ease (without uprooting your family) earlier in your career. There are lots of $90k+ jobs with well known companies available in Hunstville, Birmingham, Mobile, and other cities in Alabama.

Low COLA areas with great salaries and a chance to get some much needed experience is win-win-win. Do one or two years and then move on to something bigger and better. The biggest problem with places like Huntsville is you cannot land a decent paying position without the required security clearance and experience.

Oh yeah, GS9 job is the suck!! Unless it will definitely lead to a GS11 with career advancement opportunities. I would not take anything less than GS11.

Contract positions - research the company thoroughly. The better companies will pull you in with their incentive packages like:
Job related certs are paid (reimbursed) but you have to stay with the company for 1~2 years
Training for job related certs is free: Many have their own LMS site or have LMS partners and will send you to boot camps if time permits.
Offer $5k~$10k per year in tuition assistance for employees pursuing college degrees.
Corporate card to ease travel and job related expenses.
Relocation assistance: $5k~$10k to move to a different site.

McxRisley

kaiju wrote: »

There are lots of $90k+ jobs with well known companies available in Hunstville, Birmingham, Mobile, and other cities in Alabama.

I would like to point out that if you are expecting to make $90K right out of college, then you should probably start preparing for how to deal with extreme disappointment or plan to work 4-5 jobs.

kaiju

lol... you completely took that out of context.

All of those jobs require experience 3~5 years experience with a degree.

ratbuddy

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

facing a terrible job climate in my state (Connecticut). I have a hard time finding work even within the state

Sorry, but that is crazy talk. CT is a great place to work and live, if you can get past the constant negativity from people who just like to complain. Very tight labor market as well, you should have been able to find something very quickly. I haven't read past your first post here, have you posted your resume for review?

TechGromit

I know it sucks working something like Tier 1 Helpdesk when you have a degree, but everyone has to start somewhere. Unless you have connections, it's rare to get a job in your specialty right out of college, your going to have to take some detours to get to your destination. Just make sure where ever you get a job, it's with a big organization where you can move up into the position you desire. Working for a small business is a dead end (unless it's an IT consulting firm), except for the experience.