Lost and pissed off

Hi guys,

I doubt many of you guys remember one of my last posts from a while ago, but I'm a 21 yr old graduating from a no-name university, and I am in a kinda cruddy situation where I have good credentials from an education perspective, but no connections and facing a terrible job climate in my state (Connecticut). I have a hard time finding work even within the state (where people at least know what my university is), and applying for stuff outside the state has been relatively fruitless.

A lot of people have told me to go for a masters degree at a top school to fix that issue, but a lot more people tell me to get a job first that will help pay for that degree so that I am not taking a $100k gamble. I spoke with a friend recently who graduated from a pretty nice MBA program, but has been struggling to find work. Even she recommended I get work experience first.

Unfortunately, that creates a chicken before the egg situation as the point of the degree was to get a job, but the point of a job would be to get the degree. It feels like I'm trapped.

I hate begging people for job leads, but do any of you guys have recommendations? I'm technically gonna graduate in May, but I will have fulfilled my degree requirements by the end of January so I won't need to stay in this state anymore. Can go anywhere in the country. That would also mean I could start off with an internship in the spring, if that's something that would be preferred.

I'm an MIS major and I have experience in business analysis, project management, and Attack Surface Management aspects of cyber security. I have a little bit of work experience in each of those areas, and I'm willing to delve deeper in any of those areas.

Thanks guys.

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Comments

mactex

ratbuddy wrote: »

Sorry, but that is crazy talk. CT is a great place to work and live, if you can get past the constant negativity from people who just like to complain. Very tight labor market as well, you should have been able to find something very quickly. I haven't read past your first post here, have you posted your resume for review?

Something is wrong with Connecticut.

McxRisley

kaiju wrote: »

lol... you completely took that out of context.

All of those jobs require experience 3~5 years experience with a degree.

Lol I know but it wasn't stated so I just wanted to make OP aware of reality. I know too many people that came out of school expecting to make the big bucks(myself included).

ratbuddy

mactex wrote: »

Something is wrong with Connecticut.

Yep, that's the kind of negativity I was talking about.

Fulcrum45

In a similar vein to what Kaiju said; If you're willing to travel anywhere in the U.S. perhaps you're willing to travel anywhere in the world? Many people will say Vectrus isn't a great company to work for (wasn't my experience) BUT we're talking 100K+ salary in Afghanistan (living on a US military base), you get a security clearance and see some...interesting parts of the world. Two of my previous co-workers were taking their first IT jobs with Vectrus- one was 19 years old. Once they were done they moved on to other better paying contracts. Point is, you get that first year under your belt and you have the money, experience and mobility for more options. Plus it's a lot easier when you don't have a family to keep you grounded. Just my two cents. I can understand someone not wanting to make that a part of their IT career but it could be just the jolt it needs.

mactex

ratbuddy wrote: »

Yep, that's the kind of negativity I was talking about.

Hey, i'm not happy about it either. If it was booming with opportunity instead of facing bankruptcy; i would move the family back in a heart beat. I believe I gave the young man sound advice; based on actual data and my own experience.

NotHackingYou

Find somewhere you want to live and then find a job in that place. Avoid a masters for now until you have some experience and know what you want to specialize in.

N7Valiant

TechGuru80 wrote: »

It's always entertaining when older/married people say certain places are great places to live...except for the fact those places are usually lacking in a lot of social activities. Honestly if you are moving far from where you live and don't know people in a location, I would stick to at least around 1 million or more population because of job options and social life. Small places like Huntsville tend to be reliant on a single industry (usually government)...which could be a positive or negative depending on how you look at it...of course its negative though if budget cuts happen.

On a side note, you could never pay me enough to go to Alabama.

Can you even have a social life early in your career when most of your time is spent juggling work, studying for certs, studying for a Bachelor's?

I just assumed they called it a Bachelor's because I can't afford to have a social life until I get one.

NavyMooseCCNA

ratbuddy wrote: »

Sorry, but that is crazy talk. CT is a great place to work and live, if you can get past the constant negativity from people who just like to complain. Very tight labor market as well, you should have been able to find something very quickly. I haven't read past your first post here, have you posted your resume for review?

CT has no redeeming qualities. The government never met a tax they didn't like and drove many long term firms out of state.

xxxkaliboyxxx

TechGuru80 wrote: »

It's always entertaining when older/married people say certain places are great places to live...except for the fact those places are usually lacking in a lot of social activities. Honestly if you are moving far from where you live and don't know people in a location, I would stick to at least around 1 million or more population because of job options and social life. Small places like Huntsville tend to be reliant on a single industry (usually government)...which could be a positive or negative depending on how you look at it...of course its negative though if budget cuts happen.

On a side note, you could never pay me enough to go to Alabama.

For what's it worth, the bar scene in Huntsville is awesome, this is from me being station at RedStone (Army base in Huntsville) last year. Population is about 300k, so it's not a big city by any means, but 300k isn't small town Fort Leonard Wood status (1k).

I don't know about you guys, but I party my ass off in Huntsville and work my butt off able to pivot into private InfoSec from there. Awesome experience all around.

Some posters are right though, security clearance for almost all positions and only few companies able to provide a clearance if you don't have one. Do your research first.

ITSec14

Welcome to the bottom of the totem pole pal. You need to put the Masters degree talk aside for a while, because it won't help you when you hardly have any real experience. Stop worrying about where you went to school too, because many people don't even finish college or attempt it at all. You have options though...look for paid internships, part time, contract work, etc.

Something will come up, just keep searching and be open minded.

snokerpoker

I don't know the east coast job market at all. I will say that the Bay Area has tons of IT work. If you are able, think about moving to the Bay Area. Granted, if you are working entry level..... you will rent a small apartment or a room somewhere and juuuust have enough to get by but there are tons of opportunities around here.

Another option is try volunteering at local school district or something along those lines. That is a great way to fill in your resume with some actual hands on technical work.

EANx

TechGuru80 wrote: »

It's always entertaining when older/married people say certain places are great places to live...except for the fact those places are usually lacking in a lot of social activities.

Some places are great for introverts, others for extroverts and some for both.

Bill2nice

I was in the same boat. I was jobless after graduation when all my friends got offered.

I finally found a low paying help desk job after 4 months making 15$/hr. I worked hard and by the end of the 1st year, i was making 25$ an hour.

With that experience, I was able to jump into a system admin role, then system engineer.

Stay positive and work from the bottom up.

McxRisley

Bill2nice wrote: »

I was in the same boat. I was jobless after graduation when all my friends got offered.

I finally found a low paying help desk job after 4 months making 15$/hr. I worked hard and by the end of the 1st year, i was making 25$ an hour.

With that experience, I was able to jump into a system admin role, then system engineer.

Stay positive and work from the bottom up.

Same here, it took me a year to land my first IT job but once I did my career took off. Did 8 months as tier 2 support, then landed a DoD contracting job as a sys admin for 10 months, then moved up to C&A analyst for 10 months, then landed a pentesting role which I was in for about 5 months before moving back home and reclaiming my C&A job lol

You'll get there, just keep applying and stay positive.

Deus Ex Machina

Thanks for the information guys.

@Fulcrum45
Thanks! I've been looking into Vectrus for the past few days and it doesn't seem like a bad option at all. On my radar. My parents don't like the idea of me going to the middle east though haha.

@snorkerpoker
Bay Area sounds like paradise but I dunno if I'll be able to survive financially. I would need to get pretty lucky.

@Connecticut discussion
There's been a string of bad news surrounding this state for a very long time now. I used to be in the camp defending CT, but its hard to defend it now.

@everyone else
Yep, I know starting at the bottom of the totem pole isn't fun for anyone. I guess we all gotta start somewhere...

TheFORCE

you are too young to be lost or pissed off.

If you stress now things wont get easier.

NetworkingStudent

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

Hi guys,

I doubt many of you guys remember one of my last posts from a while ago,

Nope I don't remember your post

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

Hi guys,

I am in a kinda cruddy situation where I have good credentials from an education perspective, but no connections and facing a terrible job climate in my state (Connecticut).

You're in college, correct? Connect with people from your school on linked in! Try to meet for coffee!

What do you have in common.? You both went to the same school

Give help to thoers with in your network,before asking for help.

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

Hi guys,
I hate begging people for job leads, but do any of you guys have recommendations?
I doubt many of you guys remember one of my last posts from a while ago,

Yes, I would volunteer using your IT skills. Check out volunteer match. This is what I did when I was starting out. Also, talk to your school's student employment offfice. See if the school has any positions, or if they know of any openings with other companies.

Have you posted your resume on Dice and made it searchable? Recruiters will call you!

If you want to move you can check on this map..
Cybersecurity Supply And Demand Heat Map

It's mostly focused on info sec jobs

cshkuru

I have a Spreadsheet that I update every two weeks and keep the data for the last 6 weeks of what certs have the most jobs posted on linked in and indeed - it's based off certs that people in my office have or are pursuing, but it kind of gives an idea of where to concentrate your efforts certs wise. The last column about ratios is stolen from the cyberseek map

Jobs_12_27_2017_Graph.JPG

Jobs_12_27_2017.jpg

Fulcrum45

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

Thanks for the information guys.

@Fulcrum45
Thanks! I've been looking into Vectrus for the past few days and it doesn't seem like a bad option at all. On my radar. My parents don't like the idea of me going to the middle east though haha.

Yeah, it's a tough sell to family sometimes. If you have any questions, shoot me a PM. Been through it once and I'm currently in the process to go back for another stint.

EMT760

OP,

You're completely employable. You have what a A+, N+ and a BA. I started off at a school district with no A+ or any certs making 26 an hour for a seasonal job. I learned ALOT!, I was fortunate they needed me and I needed them. They found out I went to the same high school as they did in the district and instantly I knew , I had a shoe in..

I started off doing deployments, imaging, tickets and work orders. Patching network drops from switches,etc audio video too. They gave me keys to all the schools in the whole district and a van.

It was great! I made friends with few of the guys, older guys who are trying to retiree out. I think the youngest was 35. I wish I could have stayed at that job.

Point being don't sell yourself short. Apply for school district jobs like crazy, or any volunteer work you can. Also, you could try staffing companies. But watch your back with agencies.. One day you could find yourself out of job and not even know till its too late.

Also, embellish a bit on your resume.. Not everyone admits this..

Legacy User

@deus ex machina
Not sure how far are you from nyc but you can apply their and commute in. Its always hot for tech jobs and People do that commute.

scaredoftests

EMT760 wrote: »

OP,

You're completely employable. You have what a A+, N+ and a BA. I started off at a school district with no A+ or any certs making 26 an hour for a seasonal job. I learned ALOT!, I was fortunate they needed me and I needed them. They found out I went to the same high school as they did in the district and instantly I knew , I had a shoe in..

I started off doing deployments, imaging, tickets and work orders. Patching network drops from switches,etc audio video too. They gave me keys to all the schools in the whole district and a van. It was great! I made friends with few of the guys, older guys who are trying to retiree out. I think the youngest was 35. I wish I could have stayed at that job.

Point being don't sell yourself short. Apply for school district jobs like crazy, or any volunteer work you can. Also, you could try staffing companies. But watch your back with agencies.. One day you could find yourself out of job and not even know till its too late.

Also, embellish a bit on your resume.. Not everyone admits this..

Embellish? That could lead to problems. Especially when a person is at a interview. I have been on about 2 group interviews (last year) where we questioned a person's resume and BOTH left the interview call rather quickly.

josephbutler

Join the Military...Active Duty for a four year contract..while in you can complete your bachelors and masters through WGU, all 100% paid for by uncle sam through Tuition Assistance. When you get out after 4 years you will have your GI Bill for Life and you can pursue your Doctorate or give your ed benefits to your children or spouse.

blargoe

If you aren't particularly tied down to CT, I would definitely explore starting over somewhere else. In the meanwhile, you need to embrace working non-permanent positions if you aren't already. In my neck of the woods, most of the entry level jobs are temp or C2H anyway. Earn some experience and some $$$ for your future move while you decide where you want to live and work in the future.

HorizonThief

Hey Deus, I found six jobs here: https://www.ctreap.net/jobsrch.php?srch=400&position=460

I work in a school district. It's not a bad way of getting into the IT field. Hopefully one of those jobs is near you and fits your skills.

I wish you the best in your endeavors and hope to hear much success!

kaiju

josephbutler wrote: »

Join the Military...Active Duty for a four year contract..while in you can complete your bachelors and masters through WGU, all 100% paid for by uncle sam through Tuition Assistance. When you get out after 4 years you will have your GI Bill for Life and you can pursue your Doctorate or give your ed benefits to your children or spouse.

That's a laughable option unless he WANTS to give up A LOT of freedoms AND gets a contract that guarantees him a position in the IT field. I am a vet, IT field, who has been working for the military for quite a while. Pursue all other options before choosing the military because I have meet too many Marines, Soldiers, Sailors, and Airmen who could not adjust to military life and wasted away waiting for their contract to end.

N7Valiant

I'm starting to feel a bit of the frustration. Been applying to pretty much every available position nonstop since I got my Security+ 2 weeks ago and went down to a local "tech" job fair. Had 3 interviews, 2 with staffing agencies, and 1 with an employer introduced by one of those agencies.

I was really hoping to do at least 4 interviews a week, but hopefully this is just the holiday hiring freeze.

EANx

josephbutler wrote: »

Join the Military...Active Duty for a four year contract..while in you can complete your bachelors and masters through WGU, all 100% paid for by uncle sam through Tuition Assistance. When you get out after 4 years you will have your GI Bill for Life and you can pursue your Doctorate or give your ed benefits to your children or spouse.

Incorrect. The GI Bill is not a lifetime benefit, you get to use it up until you have been separated from the service for 15 years. https://www.benefits.va.gov/gibill/docs/pamphlets/ch33_pamphlet.pdf

A stint in the military can jump-start a career. It also gives you bonus-points for Federal hiring and in the corporate world, vets often give each other informal bonus-points in hiring, knowing what they've gone through. But as a veteran, I will agree that some people aren't cut out for it. Each service has a very different culture, doing IT in the Marine Corps (where every Marine is a rifleman) would be very different from the Air Force.

(Four enlisted personnel from each of the branches were asked what they would do if they found a scorpion in their tent. The soldier said he'd squish it with his boot while the sailor said he'd slide a piece of paper under it and flip it outside. The Marine said he'd rip the stinger off and eat it while the airman said he'd call room service and ask why there was a tent in his room.)

scaredoftests wrote: »

Embellish? That could lead to problems. Especially when a person is at a interview. I have been on about 2 group interviews (last year) where we questioned a person's resume and BOTH left the interview call rather quickly.

I agree but I also think there's a difference between embellishment, exaggeration and lying. If you supported an organization of 750 people doing helpdesk and some Active Directory:

Embellishment: Rounding up to 1000 users to make it seem like you supported a larger company
Exaggeration: Rounding up to 1000 and stating your primary job was maintaining the AD infrastructure, GPOs, etc.
Lying: Claiming to be the AD and network architect.

I don't think too many people mind a little embellishment, we recognize it's all marketing and as long as it doesn't change what you're claiming from a technical standpoint it doesn't hurt anything. But I also agree with the attitude that once you find someone is exaggerating their technical skills, you chase them to the hills with in-depth technical questions. And this will happen even with skills that aren't relevant to the job posting in question. Back-in-the-day, my company had an opening and an applicant's resume indicated extensive experience with ATM. Despite thee job requiring squat for ATM, I tossed a few softball ATM questions his way, which he promptly whiffed on. A few more misses and he was out having answered very few questions actually related to the job. I told the hiring manager that if he's lying in one area, he's probably lying in others.

technogoat

PM'ed

Been to Japan, learning Japanese and would love to live there

Deus Ex Machina

Just wanted to give you guys an update in case anyone was curious. I recently accepted a software development position at one of the major companies in my area. Thank you all for the re-encouragement, not having clear job prospects is a very scary situation and not something I would wish upon my worst enemy. Glad that's over...

I guess the key really is to just keep your chin up and keep plugging away at job applications. You never know when something might pan out.

My dad gave me a funny but true piece of advice about this whole dilemma. He told me to add every rejection to a list and to number them. He then said I only had the right to be discouraged once I reached 100 rejections on my list. Gonna be pretty hard to hit that number if you are constantly learning from your rejections and your interviews.