Unix or Linux or CCNA?

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  • phoeneousphoeneous Go ping yourself... Member Posts: 2,333 ■■■■■■■□□□
    mcsa !!!

    wtf is mcsa?
  • varelgvarelg Banned Posts: 790
    phoeneous wrote: »
    wtf is mcsa?
    It is something that will keep me busy while waiting for NightShade's book on RHCE...
  • NightShade03NightShade03 Member Posts: 1,383 ■■■■■■■□□□
    varelg wrote: »
    It is something that will keep me busy while waiting for NightShade's book on RHCE...

    Haha I appreciate that icon_wink.gif

    I blew through the MCSA no problem, but after that I just couldn't hold an interest in M$ exams...
  • Bl8ckr0uterBl8ckr0uter Inactive Imported Users Posts: 5,031 ■■■■■■■■□□
    Haha I appreciate that icon_wink.gif

    I blew through the MCSA no problem, but after that I just couldn't hold an interest in M$ exams...

    Yea so about that book......

    And also how are the RHCE studies coming?
  • UnixGuyUnixGuy Are we having fun yet? Mod Posts: 4,312 Mod
    I didn't read all the replies, but I'll talk from personal experience.

    I did my CCNA before I get a real job with UNIX.


    I didn't have real life experience with cisco gear, but I practiced in a real lab.


    Anyway, it's been three years since the last time I touched any Cisco gear, and I kind of forgot everything related to the Cisco command line. I still know the concepts but I can't do anything anymore with Cisco gear. I'm actually thinking of removing the CCNA from my resume because I don't want an employer to think I cheated or anything because I really forgot a lot of things in the material.



    It's a must to have networking fundamentals, you will be a better IT professional , generally speaking.


    My advice, it depends on the job oppourtinity. If you get a job where u need to configure/learn network devices then you will learn and it's a good experience and u can back it up with CCNA or CCNP. If you don't, then the world of Unix is so big, there are a lot of things you are expected to know, again depends on the job.

    Good luck !
    Certs: GPEN, GCFA, CISM, CRISC, RHCE
    In Progress: MBA
  • gorebrushgorebrush Member Posts: 2,743 ■■■■■■■□□□
    Paul Boz wrote: »
    I was working pretty hard on the LPIC exams before I got my current job. I pretty much stopped because we're a 100% windows shop. I would definitely encourage you to develop Linux skills, because many of the best network management solutions are on Unix/Linux. I've noticed that networking and Linux go hand in hand. Many of the network engineers that I know somewhat resent MS (as petty as that is) so much of the networking space is populated by Unix admins.

    Now that is very interesting, because I've come the other way. Started out wanting only Microsoft/MCSE etc, done all that and then CCNA was starting to emerge as my next step as for the past 3 years I've been really taken by Cisco and decided that I'd rather be doing that than Servers.

    Although I know what Linux/Unix is, I've never attempted to use it in a production environment, and if you sat me down in front of a Linux OS, although my desktop skills are excellent, it'd take me some time to get to know Linux.

    Is that bad?

    Personally I don't think so as I've never *had* to know Linux. In fact, someone I used to go to college with back in the old days (err 99-01) was adamant that I would fail as an MS Engineer because Linux was going to take over the world and bankrupt Bill Gates so my passion for MS was a waste.

    Somehow, I'm glad he was wrong... But he may still be right in some areas.
  • phoeneousphoeneous Go ping yourself... Member Posts: 2,333 ■■■■■■■□□□
    gorebrush wrote: »
    Although I know what Linux/Unix is, I've never attempted to use it in a production environment, and if you sat me down in front of a Linux OS, although my desktop skills are excellent, it'd take me some time to get to know Linux.

    Is that bad?

    It's all relative. If you work in a Linux environment and don't know Linux then yes, that is very bad.

    I like to expose my brain to the many areas of the field but really focus on the things that relate to my job. Do I need to know Linux for my current job? No. Would it help? Sure, since I'm running an Endian web filter and will soon build a Cacti/Nagios snmp box to monitor all of my Windows servers and Cisco gear.
  • it_consultantit_consultant Member Posts: 1,903
    phoeneous wrote: »
    It's all relative. If you work in a Linux environment and don't know Linux then yes, that is very bad.

    I like to expose my brain to the many areas of the field but really focus on the things that relate to my job. Do I need to know Linux for my current job? No. Would it help? Sure, since I'm running an Endian web filter and will soon build a Cacti/Nagios snmp box to monitor all of my Windows servers and Cisco gear.

    I wish I new more about UNIX but every time I try to learn to do something, I have to BASH something or modify a text file with vi. To Windows guys it is maddeningly complex to do simple tasks in Linux. Of course, in Windows if you try to troubleshoot a problem you can end up 15 layers deep when in linux it would have taken three commands. I guess its about which OS you are willing to take more abuse from.
  • stuh84stuh84 Member Posts: 503
    I prefer VI to configure rather than checkboxes that I HOPE are there, but half the time are nowhere to be seen.

    I dont see how knowing Linux and other *nix based OS's can hurt anyone, I wouldn't be in my current job doing what I do without it, and I'm a networking guy.
    Work In Progress: CCIE R&S Written

    CCIE Progress - Hours reading - 15, hours labbing - 1
  • tierstentiersten Member Posts: 4,505
    Scratch OpenSolaris from the list as under Oracle's amazing leadership, it has crashed and burned. The OpenSolaris project is dead now as Oracle won't release new changes to the closed source branch of Solaris until some unspecified time has past so they can keep the lead over the open source variants of Solaris.

    The OpenSolaris governing board has disbanded and OpenSolaris itself has been forked off into a handful of other projects but I don't see it going well.
  • varelgvarelg Banned Posts: 790
    I wish I new more about UNIX but every time I try to learn to do something, I have to BASH something or modify a text file with vi. To Windows guys it is maddeningly complex to do simple tasks in Linux. Of course, in Windows if you try to troubleshoot a problem you can end up 15 layers deep when in linux it would have taken three commands. I guess its about which OS you are willing to take more abuse from.
    If you aren't a fan of emacs/vi editors (or any other editor for which you need to learn a programming language to be able to use that editor) you can use nano, just plain simple text editor on the CLI.
    "To Windows guys it is maddeningly complex to do simple tasks in Linux."
    If you meant desktop tasks, yes. It can get rough depending on the distro you picked. Server however is a different story.
  • Paul BozPaul Boz Member Posts: 2,620 ■■■■■■■■□□
    varelg wrote: »
    If you aren't a fan of emacs/vi editors (or any other editor for which you need to learn a programming language to be able to use that editor) you can use nano, just plain simple text editor on the CLI.
    "To Windows guys it is maddeningly complex to do simple tasks in Linux."
    If you meant desktop tasks, yes. It can get rough depending on the distro you picked. Server however is a different story.

    Nano and Pico are excellent. If you're trying to Learn Linux it can become very discouraging to be both on a new platform with no idea what to do, but also have to learn how to basically "program" the configs.
    CCNP | CCIP | CCDP | CCNA, CCDA
    CCNA Security | GSEC |GCFW | GCIH | GCIA
    [email protected]
    http://twitter.com/paul_bosworth
    Blog: http://www.infosiege.net/
  • it_consultantit_consultant Member Posts: 1,903
    stuh84 wrote: »
    I prefer VI to configure rather than checkboxes that I HOPE are there, but half the time are nowhere to be seen.

    I dont see how knowing Linux and other *nix based OS's can hurt anyone, I wouldn't be in my current job doing what I do without it, and I'm a networking guy.

    Truth is, I ought to know more about linux then I do, but none of my clients use linux and most of the solutions they look for run on Windows or a pre-installed linux in an appliance.

    Linux admins probably feel more 'at one' with their systems as they control every minute detail if they wan't too. At some point Windows admins develop a weird conflation of GUI and command line skills. For example, I know the command to change an IP of a card, change the order of DNS servers, etc, but its just as quick to do it through the GUI and I don't need a reference to remember all the required netshell commands. Netshell is great, you can apply the settings without rebooting or restarting any services.

    However if I want to edit the hosts file its notepad -C:\WINDOWS\System32\drivers\etc\hosts - launches the host file in notepad and I am good to go.

    Now Windows is getting silly with Powershell, all the "break me" commands in Exchange can only be accessed through the shell, which forces me to make sure I know what I'm doing before I try anything crazy. I assume powershell is specifically targeted to *nix people to make them feel more comfortable. I don't know too many Windows admins who were lining up to get more command line options.
  • dynamikdynamik Banned Posts: 12,312 ■■■■■■■■■□
    I don't know too many Windows admins who were lining up to get more command line options.

    ¿En serio?

    Good Windows admins have always been proponents of scripting and shell commands.
  • RobertKaucherRobertKaucher A cornfield in OhioMember Posts: 4,299 ■■■■■■■■■■
    dynamik wrote: »
    ¿En serio?

    Good Windows admins have always been proponents of scripting and shell commands.

    Falou a verdade aqui!

    MS has been promising something like PowerShell since the days of NT. Windows admins have been crying and begging for this for years.

    It's not targetted towards *nix people at all. It has become a standard for Microsoft server administrative automation. It is now a fundamental aspect of SQL Server, SharePoint, and Exchange Server.

    If you are a Windows Admin and you have not learned PowerShell you are already behind the curve.
  • Bl8ckr0uterBl8ckr0uter Inactive Imported Users Posts: 5,031 ■■■■■■■■□□
    If you are a Windows Admin and you have not learned PowerShell you are already behind the curve.

    And there it is.
  • dynamikdynamik Banned Posts: 12,312 ■■■■■■■■■□
    knwminus wrote: »
    And there it is.

    *BOOM* Headshot!

    If it's any consolation, I'm pretty terrible with it at the moment. It's one of the things that are at the top of my to-do list once I finish up a couple of classes.
  • docricedocrice Member Posts: 1,706 ■■■■■■■■■■
    As someone who's been slowly migrating away from the Windows skillset for a little while, I'm getting behind the curve. But yes, PowerShell is much nicer than using batch or VBScript.
    However if I want to edit the hosts file its notepad -C:\WINDOWS\System32\drivers\etc\hosts - launches the host file in notepad and I am good to go.

    Script nerds would rather do: notepad %SystemRoot%\system32\drivers\etc\hosts. Heh. Or perhaps break out the old edit command.

    From an administration standpoint, GUIs are slowly eroding in some ways. Take a look a Server Core. That's practically all CLI (unless you're administering remotely with GUI tools). I'm not much of a scripter by any means, but I will say that Unix has always been more favorable in this regard given the kinds of tools that comes with the system.
    Hopefully-useful stuff I've written: http://kimiushida.com/bitsandpieces/articles/
  • tierstentiersten Member Posts: 4,505
    docrice wrote: »
    Or perhaps break out the old edit command.
    It got removed in 64 bit versions of Windows. It also used to have a nasty habit of mangling files but I think they fixed that...
  • veritas_libertasveritas_libertas CISSP, GIAC x5, CompTIA x5 Greenville, SC USAMember Posts: 5,745 ■■■■■■■■■■
    dynamik wrote: »
    *BOOM* Headshot!

    If it's any consolation, I'm pretty terrible with it at the moment. It's one of the things that are at the top of my to-do list once I finish up a couple of classes.

    I have the same problem. Can't wait to get to Powershell after graduating icon_wink.gif
  • earweedearweed Member Posts: 5,192 ■■■■■■■■■□
    dynamik wrote: »
    *BOOM* Headshot!

    If it's any consolation, I'm pretty terrible with it at the moment. It's one of the things that are at the top of my to-do list once I finish up a couple of classes.
    I'm clueless at it now but it's on my "to do" list.
    No longer work in IT. Play around with stuff sometimes still and fix stuff for friends and relatives.
  • phoeneousphoeneous Go ping yourself... Member Posts: 2,333 ■■■■■■■□□□
    Ive seen parts of this, it is good.

    CBT Nuggets
  • TheShadowTheShadow Member Posts: 1,057 ■■■■■■□□□□
    phoeneous wrote: »
    Ive seen parts of this, it is good.

    CBT Nuggets

    Yes a very decent CBT

    Powershell == Bankai
    Who knows what evil lurks in the heart of technology?... The Shadow DO
  • Bl8ckr0uterBl8ckr0uter Inactive Imported Users Posts: 5,031 ■■■■■■■■□□
    TheShadow wrote: »
    Yes a very decent CBT

    Powershell == Bankai


    Bleach for the win!
  • it_consultantit_consultant Member Posts: 1,903
    docrice wrote: »
    As someone who's been slowly migrating away from the Windows skillset for a little while, I'm getting behind the curve. But yes, PowerShell is much nicer than using batch or VBScript.



    Script nerds would rather do: notepad %SystemRoot%\system32\drivers\etc\hosts. Heh. Or perhaps break out the old edit command.

    From an administration standpoint, GUIs are slowly eroding in some ways. Take a look a Server Core. That's practically all CLI (unless you're administering remotely with GUI tools). I'm not much of a scripter by any means, but I will say that Unix has always been more favorable in this regard given the kinds of tools that comes with the system.

    As an Exchange Admin, I have had to conform to powershell very quickly, otherwise I would be useless. PowerGUI is useful when creating and editing PS scripts - which makes my job slightly easier. Between Exchange 2007 and 2010 some cmdlets have been moved to the GUI (like certificates) and others have been moved strictly to the shell. Shell commands between 2010 RTM and 2010 SP1 (import-mailbox as opposed to new-mailboximport request) have changed for no apparent reason. Of course there is a technical difference between mailbox imports between RTM and SP1 but thats all under the hood, they could have kept the old command. This illustrates my irritation with using powershell. In Cisco devices I can use most of the same commands in any switch or router produced since Cisco swallowed Catalyst.

    One of my best servers is a server core DNS and Domain Controller which forced me to remember all my netsh commands when I set it up. Oddly enough the interface is the old command line, I would like it better if it were a powershell prompt instead.

    Having said that I have a standard installation of Server 08 R2 at another client which is performing the same role and has been just as reliable. Server core is great because it prevents people from loading silly things on servers that should be dedicated.

    I stand by my previous statement, the number one complaint I have heard from Windows and Exchange admins over the last two years is the shell. My sample may be made up entirely of cranky sticks in the mud but I doubt it.
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