Student Experiences at Western Governors University (WGU)

CBaer

This is a legitimate school with legitimate requirements. What you don't have to worry about here though is sitting through lectures or assignments on material you already know. This reduces the time needed to completion if you successfully prove your competency. That means the mileage may vary. I'm in IT, well experienced, and still put in 10+ hours a week to complete even the truncated subject matter I needed. For me, programming and databases held me up; networking, security, business and PM didn't because I didn't have add many key gaps.

Some people put in 10, some people put in 40.

Nemowolf

CBaer wrote: »

This is a legitimate school with legitimate requirements. What you don't have to worry about here though is sitting through lectures or assignments on material you already know. This reduces the time needed to completion if you successfully prove your competency. That means the mileage may vary. I'm in IT, well experienced, and still put in 10+ hours a week to complete even the truncated subject matter I needed. For me, programming and databases held me up; networking, security, business and PM didn't because I didn't have add many key gaps.

Some people put in 10, some people put in 40.

Totally agree. I have a good amount of time doing help desk so the starting certificates were easy but now that I am moving to things like security and networking, not so much. What I used to breeze through (20hrs a week tops) is now taking me far more time (30+ hrs per week). Some certificates are going to be "easy" because you can memorize terms and definitions and understand the general concepts to get an easy pass but you wont take anything away because you didnt really learn much.

TLeTourneau

I haven't posted in some time. Work and life get in the way.

I've just submitted my Technical Writing. It has been a grind for me, VERY low motivation over the last several months. If the Tech Writing makes it I will only have four courses left. I just need to buckle down and get it done!

xiny

Due to the amount of certifications i had and my Associates degree i was able to pretty much waive most of the requirements for the BS in IT: InfoSec.
I started in May and should be getting my degree in October.

Also just finished my Technical Writing, it should be getting approved today.
Only thing i have left to finish is the DB Specialist Class (ezpz) CCNA Security (ezpz) and the Capstone.

TO be able to get my Bachelors Degree in 1 term for $3000 is a steal.

TLeTourneau

Tech Writing was approved, yay! Time to finish up the capstone, I'll hopefully get it submitted by the end of the week.

revelated

Greetings all. I figured I would share my experiences at WGU as a full time worker in the field for which I'm getting a degree (IT).

A side note: this forum doesn't work in IE10/Windows8. Can't do a carriage return in the reply box. Bizarre.

Anyway, If you're considering WGU, I'm going to warn you to not judge the school by its enrollment process. It's clunky, archaic, and the "Enrollment Counselors" are glorified sales reps who will turn you off quickly. They read off of scripts and ask the same questions over and over. I actually had to request a replacement for mine, the first guy I spoke to went on leave and never came back, the second guy was incompetent and got on my nerves. The third guy was awesome and did exactly what I needed done to get enrolled.

The "entrance exam" is a joke. Designed only to test your basic abilities to perform mathematical functions, write simple essays, that sort of thing. They asked me the exact same things that I was asked nearly two decades ago when I was about to enroll in community college in San Diego - which means they're working off a template somewhere. Not hard stuff but I will say, if you struggle with any of this, the school is NOT for you. Especially with the writing exercise. If you only have a GED, you might struggle with it.

Once enrolled things went smoothly, although the claim of "Education Without Boundaries" is a borderline bait pitch. While it's true you're mostly in control of your progress, you're tethered to a student mentor who is your gateway to signing up for courses. You can set them online, sure, but that mentor has to "approve" you taking them. You also have to have weekly calls with them about progress despite them being able to see your progress online. Some may prefer this nanny behavior, I don't. In the first term I was accelerating courses like crazy simply because they weren't hard, and then she tried to put the brakes on me to slow down. I actually escalated the issue because if it's "Without Boundaries" I shouldn't be limited, and they agreed. So now it's in my control, and I agreed not to escalate if I wasn't 100% sure I could knock it out. Second term I took a lot more time to do courses because they weren't that easy (like TJP1 and TJC1).

You need to be careful about some programs where the course material and the preassessment don't match the assessment, and you take it and fail it, report the problem and then WGU changes the assessment and/or the cut score to more closely match reality (TJC1 comes to mind). WGU won't remove the fail even though it's their fault. They'll just tell you "as long as you pass that's all your transcript shows" which is fine, but unethical to let a student fail an exam because they can't keep their stuff up to date. Same with some of the Microsoft exams where people are struggling because of the way Microsoft does their tests; they will give you two answers that are blatantly wrong and two answers where both could be right, but they want the "Microsoft Answer". WGU's materials don't help you here. CompTIA exams, your best bet is to buy a book, because the WGU materials are worthless.

I'm now down to 40 CUs remaining for graduation with intent to get those done by 2015, especially with the new course changes they're doing for September. It'll remove like 6 courses I hate (Biology and Programming) and add three I'm cool with (Science and Linux), plus increase the CUs for certain difficult courses (like CIC1/College Algebra). If I can knock those three out plus Algebra, I'll just have Physics, Tech Writing, Literature, and the Capstone.

I transferred in a LOT of certifications. This is my first fully enrolled college experience, so I did not transfer any college credits. If you get A+, Network+, Project+, Security+, MCSA, MCTS, MCSE and CCNA, you'll largely waive every possible program-specific course. If you have an applied associates degree, you'll waive most every GE course. Remember that if you choose to waive courses, you will not get the certs that come with the courses you waived. But if you have a ton of certs and an associates degree you'll breeze through WGU in no time.

Negatives?

• Nobody cares about CIW certs. Period. Yet for most of the IT tracks they're all you get. Their exams are horrifically easy, some of which haven't been updated in over a decade. The JavaScript one, for example, I did so fast that the exam monitor was looking skeptical.
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• WGU's "programming" is more about reading and understanding code - specifically Java, HTML, and JavaScript - than actually coding. That's fine, but if you're a person expecting greater programming knowledge, you'll be disappointed.
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• You can't choose electives. You're thrown into a specific type of elective without any say-so. For example I got put in Biology (soon to change to Sciences) where I might have preferred Chemistry or something else more exciting. In traditional schools you get this choice and WGU should seriously consider that model for the elective courses.
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• You can't just put courses in and take assessments. You have to wait for your mentor to approve things which can sometimes take a day or two. Unnecessary overhead and cost for the school for a student that's self motivated.
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• The Performance Assessment-type courses are just busywork; boring and not engaging. I dread doing them every time. Especially ones where you have to do a video or whatever. Also having to do APA standards on courses having nothing to do with English Composition feels forced and awkward. There are times they force you to use references even if you don't need any to write about the subject matter. That's a turn-off.
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• If you fail a course because the material doesn't match WGU won't take ownership of the problem without you haranging them about it.
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• Some courses don't "Teach" you anything. They just tell you what you need to know to pass the test (AGC1 comes to mind). That's fine, but if you're planning to learn things, this is not the school for you.

Danielm7

Interesting write up, a few points about the negatives you mentioned.

-CIW certs, it's just because WGU doesn't have an exam yet to match those classes, the certs are useless, so don't list them, that's what I do. Since you already have a pile of certs walking in, just treat the CIW as another exam, not a new cert.

-Programming, unless you're doing the software dev track, the programming classes are intro classes, I wouldn't expect someone who has done an intro class to be a serious programmer. If you like coding there are countless resources online where you can learn it on your own.

-Agree on the electives, but it's just the way the school is setup, would be nice but for most students it would just be added administrative hassle.

-The mentor thing. Try to look at the flip side of that coin. While you might have been ready to take an exam quickly, the majority of their students might not be. Lots of people go online and find stories of people who do 80 credits a term, and think they'll do that too without effort, so they'd just jump in, fail a bunch of classes, withdraw, etc. The mentors are there to keep people at a pace where they won't just fail and drop out. Sometimes it is frustrating when you want to work quickly, but if you don't mesh with your mentor, find a new one. I was very clear with my mentor, he pretty much stayed out of my way and added any classes I wanted. He was a little unsure at first, then when I passed my first few when I told him I would then he gave me free reign.

-For APA standards and such, it's annoying, but you have to do those at any other legit school too.

-I didn't have an issue with the WGU material not matching up, might have just been the classes I took. Even for all the CompTIA ones, the material I got with my classes was fine, I might have worked on some outside resources on my own too but everyone learns differently.

Thanks for the input and good luck towards knocking out those last 40 quickly.

revelated

I submit that the majority of students with partial college experience would expect to be able to choose electives - and in fact would appreciate the chance to do so. Some courses just aren't engaging. For me, I'd much rather go with the logical Chemistry than be saddled with biology, when my field is IT. A person going to be an RN is obviously going to want Biology rather than Chemistry, and so on.

As far as material not matching, there is a thread over on WGUStudents talking about TJC1, it was the most notorious example. But there are threads upon threads where students are repeatedly failing the Microsoft exams because the WGU material is insufficient. I waived almost all of my Microsoft ones, but I do have Software Development Fundamentals which is unfortunately an MTA course.

APA standards, most schools don't care about references if it's a paper about a subject for which you're the subject matter.

CIW, WGU could very easily beef up those courses and offer Microsoft or other more reputable certs. I'm not negating the value of getting a cert, I'm questioning the specific cert authority when they don't refresh their exams at all.

Mentors, that's fine as an option. Not as a forced thing. For students who know they can't self-pace, sure, offer the option of mentor guidance. For students that are not at the moment meeting SAP, sure, force the mentor to get them back on track. But for someone who blows through a term and knocks out 40 CUs, why bother with the mentor? Clearly that student can pace themselves, and I shouldn't have to beg them to untether me. It should be "let's tether these students that are struggling, the students who are doing well, leave them alone until and unless they start struggling".



It might seem like I'm down on the school; I'm not. I'm sharing the full experience so people understand that not all of it is good or bad. Since they changed the BS IT course listing I feel it's a lot more manageable with less stupid courses and more logical, sensible ones, and more CU for certain courses. And NO COLLEGE ALGEBRA!!!!

WGU is a good school and clearly they're evolving things as they get feedback, so that counts. And I think it's a good school, but if I had to do it all over again, I would more carefully chosen my track such that more courses were waived.

zidian

revelated wrote: »

Greetings all. I figured I would share my experiences at WGU as a full time worker in the field for which I'm getting a degree (IT).

Great post that outlines the school pretty well. I'm nearly done with my degree and agree with the majority of your points. I'm in the IT-Software Track if that matters for reference.

The only point I don't really agree with is the CompTIA Exams. I took A+, Net+, Sec+ and Project+ through WGU. I used the WGU Materials as the primary learning resource and passed all of them with ease. I did use a few other free online resources like Darrill's website or the Professor Messer videos as well, but sparingly. The only exam prep I was disappointed on was Sec+. The WGU materials includes way too much that isn't on that exam, so there is large risk of over-studying on non-covered material. I'd recommend a different book for that class only (Darrill's book to be exact). The others, especially A+ and Net+, I thought the WGU material provided exactly what was needed to pass.

Also, for enrollment counselors, if he still works for WGU, Dustin Bolt was amazing. He knew his stuff and put up with me having to take a 6 month break before initial acceptance and starting courses (due to reimbursement changes at work). I even found a problem on my transcript during my second term and between him and my mentor they got it fixed for me.

revelated

zidian wrote: »

Great post that outlines the school pretty well. I'm nearly done with my degree and agree with the majority of your points. I'm in the IT-Software Track if that matters for reference.

The only point I don't really agree with is the CompTIA Exams. I took A+, Net+, Sec+ and Project+ through WGU. I used the WGU Materials as the primary learning resource and passed all of them with ease. I did use a few other free online resources like Darrill's website or the Professor Messer videos as well, but sparingly. The only exam prep I was disappointed on was Sec+. The WGU materials includes way too much that isn't on that exam, so there is large risk of over-studying on non-covered material. I'd recommend a different book for that class only (Darrill's book to be exact). The others, especially A+ and Net+, I thought the WGU material provided exactly what was needed to pass.

Also, for enrollment counselors, if he still works for WGU, Dustin Bolt was amazing. He knew his stuff and put up with me having to take a 6 month break before initial acceptance and starting courses (due to reimbursement changes at work). I even found a problem on my transcript during my second term and between him and my mentor they got it fixed for me.

Huh? I never said the CompTIA ones were blatantly insufficient but there are stories upon stories about people, specifically with A+ and Project+, struggling with the WGU materials. I only did Project+ through WGU and while it gives you a lot of information, it's not targeted to passing the course and in some cases, is detrimental to you doing so. There IS such a thing as information overload, and the Project Management is likely the best possible example of this.

In the real world, 80% of what they talk about simply does not apply. That's not WGU's fault, but I do feel that some of their courses could be pared down tremendously.

ratbuddy

revelated wrote: »

There IS such a thing as information overload, and the Project Management is likely the best possible example of this.

Sorry, no. That course is easy as pie, and can be easily passed with nothing more than an 11-hour Pluralsight video series. It's very basic, but also very helpful to know in the real world, especially if you ever want to move beyond the help desk.

xiny

My overall experience with WGU is positive. I have had my doubt about certain courses.
My only complaint, as well, is the Mentor, there are sometimes when they are helpful but overall i didn't understand the point of them.
For Instance, i'm ran through my courses as fast as i could to avoid having to pay for another semester. Mentors did inhibit my ability to speed through the degree because, as someone posted earlier, they have to approve your enrollment into the course, and 9 out of 10 times they where either (A) out of town on a meeting or (B) Slow as hell to respond or get back to me.

Then you want to get your voucher approved to take your Certification Exam. First your Mentor has to approve and then the WGU Assessment team has to send you the voucher via email which can take days.

You're not exactly able to go at your own pace when there are several speed bumps.


Edit: I guess i have a second complaint
The Bachelors in IT:InfoSec does not have any courses that focus on Risk Management, it's in the Masters Degree but not the Bachelors. To have courses that focus on CIW Exams such as Web Design...but not Risk Management absolutely baffles me.

goatama

I'm in the BSIT:InfoSec track and one thing has baffled me since I started. When they reviewed my transcripts for my AAS degree, they didn't give me credit for hardly any of my programming classes. Which is odd to me since my degree was AAS Computer Programmer/Analyst. They knocked off the software development fundamentals, but I still have object oriented design and Java classes to take. I submit that the six varied programming classes (Assembly, Java, C, C++, VB.NET, and data structures) should have handily knocked out the requirements.

So I asked them about it. The response I received was that they are only accepted as transfers if the transfer credit was a *certification*. The funny thing is, you don't get any certifications from the classes WGU offers. They couldn't adequately explain why it was they only accept certs for something they don't give certs for.

Fortunately, my program will change at the end of this term (anybody else find it odd how often the programs change? This'll be my third time since 2012) and I'll get Python (I think) and something else. But no Java.

xiny

goatama wrote: »

I'm in the BSIT:InfoSec track and one thing has baffled me since I started. When they reviewed my transcripts for my AAS degree, they didn't give me credit for hardly any of my programming classes. Which is odd to me since my degree was AAS Computer Programmer/Analyst. They knocked off the software development fundamentals, but I still have object oriented design and Java classes to take. I submit that the six varied programming classes (Assembly, Java, C, C++, VB.NET, and data structures) should have handily knocked out the requirements.

So I asked them about it. The response I received was that they are only accepted as transfers if the transfer credit was a *certification*. The funny thing is, you don't get any certifications from the classes WGU offers. They couldn't adequately explain why it was they only accept certs for something they don't give certs for.

Fortunately, my program will change at the end of this term (anybody else find it odd how often the programs change? This'll be my third time since 2012) and I'll get Python (I think) and something else. But no Java.

My Associates had nothing to do with programming and i didn't haven't taken a single Programming Class at WGU (only have 3 classes left) granted the java course was removed before i started. The certifications i used to waive classes were, A+, Net+, SSCP, and CCNA.

goatama

My Associates had nothing to do with programming and i didn't haven't taken a single Programming Class at WGU (only have 3 classes left) granted the java course was removed before i started. The certifications i used to waive classes were, A+, Net+, SSCP, and CCNA.

Man, I wish I'd gotten your program. Oh well, I'll be done by April, hopefully, and then it's on to the Master's. I think.

xiny

goatama wrote: »

Man, I wish I'd gotten your program. Oh well, I'll be done by April, hopefully, and then it's on to the Master's. I think.

I'm in the IT: InfoSec track as well, if i can manage to fork up the money i'd really like to get the Masters in InfoSec and Assurance as well.


EDIT: On a Side note Passed my Capstone this morning WOOT! WOOT!

arwes

^^^ Congrats!!

Finally finished QLT1 a few minutes ago, only had like 4 revisions to Task 4 LOL. All I have left is IWC1, IWT1, the technical writing one and then capstone. With regards to IWC1 & IWT1, any recommendations on which to go after first? I may just brush up on IWC1 tonight and take the preassessment tomorrow evening to see how it goes.

ratbuddy

As I'm telling a couple folks in the WGU IRC channel, use https://wgu.adobeconnect.com/_a814884580/p27scaxf1gz/ for IWT1 task two. Just make a blank .ppt, and add each of those sample slides along with the descriptions. Replace the instructions in the sample slides with real 'stuff' as you go. I did something like 3-5 sentences or bullet points on each slide. Force yourself to do five a day, and you'll be done with that project in under a week.

arwes

Thanks for that! I'll be giving that strategy a shot this week for sure.

Nobylspoon

I'm currently working on the CHFI exam and I noticed the iClass videos can be downloaded locally if you hit the direct link in a browser. Thanks to this find, I can now watch my lectures on the big screen in my on private movie theater using Riftmax Theater and my Oculus Rift DK2. As someone with ADHD that ends up opening 20+ tabs while "watching" my CBTs, this new way of watching the content keeps me much more focused.If any others have an Oculus Rift, I highly recommend trying this out when watching lectures!

bugzy3188

Just curious if anyone is in the B.S. in IT Management program. I am strongly considering it. I am a technical person at heart but feel this degree could really open up some doors for me. I have always been able to learn the technical stuff on my own and wanted to broaden my horizons. With that said I am curious to see if anyone else is enrolled and what your thoughts are, just in general of this program. Thanks!

Cisc0kidd

Just to clarify, it is a BS in Business with an emphasis in IT Management.

JayLQue

I will be starting with WGU soon, any advice or info on what to expect?
How are the tests given there and are they proctored and or timed?
What will be the hardest or most challenging thing to look for?
I was also thinking of taking the MSITM vs MSISA, not sure which course would be most needed in the IT world any and all input s welcomed?
Any advice on anything that would help me since I do work a full time job, married with kids and my time is really limited, thanks

Danielm7

Tests are done a few ways, some/most of the IT courses are industry certifications so they'll be at local testing centers. Those are both proctored and timed. Some are WGU exams, which you take proctored on a webcam, also timed, but from home. Then some are papers and projects you turn in, they get graded, you pass, the class is complete.

Hardest or most challenging is going to be totally dependent on you and your background. For a lot of people it's just staying motivated when you don't have a teacher in front of you giving you deadlines.

Which masters is up to you too, just depends on what you like. Don't take the security one if you aren't interested in security thinking it'll get you a job more easily.

As for advice. Block off time, hope your wife and kids are understanding, because they will need to be. I'm married with a child too, it can be hard sometime if you're doing it all at home and trying to plow through material quickly.

aftereffector

NOLAJ wrote: »

Anyone else notice the change on Taskstream? Shows the number your paper is in the queue. Pretty cool.

I just noticed this. It's very cool. My assignment is #85, and they are currently evaluating submissions from Monday.


EDIT: Now it's #86. Odd...

bugzy3188

Looks like I am in, my previous schooling and certs netted me about 36 CUs which is a little over a quarter of the entire degree! Based on the 4 class per term agenda that they are recommending it looks like about 2.5 years to complete, with that said I should be able to knock it out sooner than that (I would hope...). Assuming an understanding that each course is different in terms of how long it takes, I am curious to see what other people are averaging on a course per term basis...again, just looking for a general average...

TomkoTech

An average isn't going to tell you anything. Everyone here has a different level of competency in their particular subjects, how they learn/retain new information, and countless other differences.

I just finished my first semester. I did 21 CUs. And I slacked. Majorly. I could have probably done 40 CUs without much effort had I not wasted literally 3 months of my term. Like didn't even sign in and check the materials.

It will depend on how focused you are. That's is probably the biggest deterrent to mass amounts of courses.

zidian

I just finished my degree. My terms ended up being around 26/16/25/15. My second term I took nearly 3 months off after moving across the country for work. My first and third term I would say I wasted 4 to 8 weeks of study time by slacking too much. My last term was just what was left over. If not for slacking or moving across the country for work, I could have easily done 35ish per term.

As a point of reference, I work full time, usually 45ish hours a week and I'm married with a 2 year old.

olaHalo

Has anyone taken DJV1 Software Development Fundamentals lately?
Seems a little odd and a quick search shows that MS may have changed this exam a lot lately.

nelson8403

olaHalo keep in mind you may not have to take that class, if you take any other web programming in your course of study you can eliminate that one. I did that with TYC1 (or TXC1)